Conspiracy_Of_Doves writes to tell us Brett Thomas over at Bit-Tech recently interviewed Elder Scrolls producer, Gavin Carter. From the article: "The size, scope and sheer graphical grunt required for Elder Scrolls 4: Oblivion requires gigahertz of processing power to run, good bandwidth to update and expand, and gigabytes of hard disk space to store. Things that a console didn't really have...until now." The interview takes a look at the development with respect to the two different platforms, PC and Xbox 360. Gavin Carter Discusses Elder Scrolls Log in/Create an Account | Top | 153 comments | Search Discussion Display Options Threshold: -1: 153 comments 0: 146 comments 1: 109 comments 2: 79 comments 3: 20 comments 4: 13 comments 5: 10 comments Flat Nested No Comments Threaded Oldest First Newest First Highest Scores First Oldest First (Ignore Threads) Newest First (Ignore Threads) The Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way. so no xbox 360 core? (Score:5, Insightful) by El_Muerte_TDS (592157) <elmuerte@drun[ ]ipers.com ['ksn' in gap]> on Wednesday November 09, @03:44PM (#13991913) (http://elmuerte.com/) gigabytes of hard disk space to storeXBox 360 core dosn't have gigbytes of disk space. [ Reply to ThisRe:so no xbox 360 core? by qortra (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @03:48PMRe:so no xbox 360 core? by antifoidulus (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:02PMRe:so no xbox 360 core? by qortra (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:06PMRe:so no xbox 360 core? by timeOday (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:24PMRe:so no xbox 360 core? by blincoln (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:15PMRe:so no xbox 360 core? by utnow (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:36PMRe:so no xbox 360 core? by Anonymous Coward (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @08:33PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:so no xbox 360 core? by Mac Degger (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:24PMRe:so no xbox 360 core? by wbren (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @03:56PMRe:so no xbox 360 core? by jpx7777 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @03:59PMRe:so no xbox 360 core? by wbren (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:14PMRe:so no xbox 360 core? by dbug78 (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @04:25PMRe:so no xbox 360 core? by wbren (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:47PMRe:so no xbox 360 core? by MBraynard (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:23PMRe:so no xbox 360 core? by Jace of Fuse! (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @10:14PMRe:so no xbox 360 core? by earnest murderer (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:55PMRe:so no xbox 360 core? by garvon (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @04:35PMRe:so no xbox 360 core? by Hast (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @11:19PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.It's about the size of the game by DeadScreenSky (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:31PM2 replies beneath your current threshold. On PC, though... (Score:1, Insightful) by BronxBomber (633404) on Wednesday November 09, @03:56PM (#13992057) To me this game begs to be played on PC. With the HDR lighting its going to blow the 360 version out of the water, along with some other shading/lighting effects the 360 wont have..And the TESCS - thats just a must have. I made the mistake of playing this on Xbox first, and while it rawked, I wish I could have modded it. It would have made an already ridiculously deep game even better. I nearly bought it twice so I could mess with the TESCS, but I got into WoW instead. [ Reply to ThisRe:On PC, though... by Dixie Flatliner (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:05PMRe:On PC, though... by Mac Degger (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:27PMRe:On PC, though... by Hast (Score:2) Thursday November 10, @12:54AM1 reply beneath your current threshold. Re:On PC, though... (Score:5, Informative) by MightyPez (734706) on Wednesday November 09, @04:06PM (#13992175) Why exactly won't the XBox 360 have these lighting features? The GPU in the 360 is a next generation video card made by ATI, like nothing on the market right now. Do you have some insider knowledge that it won't have abilities of current DirectX 9 video cards? [ Reply to This | ParentRe:On PC, though... by BronxBomber (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @04:17PMRe:On PC, though... by Gulthek (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:24PMRe:On PC, though... by MightyPez (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:30PMRe:On PC, though... by Intocabile (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:40PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:On PC, though... by master_p (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:12PMRe:On PC, though... by Hast (Score:2) Thursday November 10, @12:48AMRe:On PC, though... by Cheapy (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:33PMRe:On PC, though... by Carnildo (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:50PMRe:On PC, though... by Cheapy (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @08:20PMRe:On PC, though... by ToasterofDOOM (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @09:49PM I got old too soon (Score:5, Insightful) by milktoastman (572643) on Wednesday November 09, @03:57PM (#13992073) As a college undergrad, I was interested in the Elder Scrolls 2 from watching others play. I never really had a computer that could run it. In Grad school, sans flies, I bought a computer to run Elder Scrolls 3 and was so looking forward to playing a computer/console RPG of the likes I had dreamed of since 8th grade...but when I tried it, I realized, I just couldn't get absorbed. It required such an investment of time and interest that my busy life wouldn't allow. Also, I actually felt guilty playing because I knew how much valuable 'real time' was going to waste. I guess I'm too old to play these games now. Too bad my last fling was Ultima 9. Kind of cool, but not what I had dreamed of playing. Don't you wish the sheeny scales would flute madly? [ Reply to ThisRe:I got old too soon by planetoid (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @04:10PM Re:I got old too soon (Score:5, Interesting) by Gulthek (12570) on Wednesday November 09, @04:18PM (#13992272) (http://www.stephenball.net/ | Last Journal: Thursday April 25, @09:03PM) Holy Avatar, you're last RPG fling was Ultima 9? I'm so sorry.My brother and I actually downgraded our gaming machine from a modern (at the time) video card to two 3DFx cards in SLI (it was designed for Glide) so we could play U9 without it crashing every 5 minutes. Then it only crashed every 20 minutes.Not to mention being so incredibly awful that it actually made us yearn for the days of cheap sprite graphics and dungeon running in Ultima 5/6/7. Or even Ultima 4. Almost Ultima 3. Not "Avatars in Space" Ultima 2, and not "Glorified Nethack" Ultima though. And I don't think anything will ever make me yearn for the spell casting atrocity of Ultima 8 (and the sad fall of Dupre). [ Reply to This | ParentRe:I got old too soon by furrywithwings (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:21PMI admit it. by earnest murderer (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:44PMRe:I admit it. by limabone (Score:1) Thursday November 10, @12:00AMRe:I got old too soon by Angry Toad (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:37PM Re:I got old too soon (Score:5, Funny) by TrappedByMyself (861094) on Wednesday November 09, @06:09PM (#13993365) You should try World of Warcraft. You can play at a leisurely pace and not have to worry about getting sucked in.Definitely the game for RPG fans with busy lives. [ Reply to This | ParentRe:I got old too soon by Phoenixhunter (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:21PM2 replies beneath your current threshold. One other thing (Score:5, Informative) by BronxBomber (633404) on Wednesday November 09, @04:00PM (#13992100) If you want to try the one that started it all, go here [elderscrolls.com]. Its free. Windoze only and you need DOSBox. [ Reply to ThisRe:One other thing by Linzer (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @04:03PMRe:One other thing by BronxBomber (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @04:07PMRe:One other thing by HunterZ (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:34PMRe:One other thing by HunterZ (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:50PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:One other thing by gringer (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:34PM 2q 2006 (Score:3, Interesting) by selfabuse (681350) on Wednesday November 09, @04:09PM (#13992198) Wonder how Microsoft feels about them knocking the release date back another 6 months. I was at the local EBGames recently, and they were mentioning how many people had already called to cancel their xbox360 preorders - and this was just a day or two after the delay was "discovered". I say discovered, because the publisher, Take 2, mentioned it on their financial statement, but it took a week and >45 200 post topics on the elder scrolls forum to choke a response out of Bethesda. Even then, their response was to sliently change the release date in the FAQ. Just in the past day or so the PR guy made a statement, but I think the damage has already been done. Knocking it back another 6 months gives me time to save up for some new hardware to run the PC version instead of buying the 360 like I had planned. [ Reply to ThisRe:2q 2006 by Vacuous (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @04:38PMRe:2q 2006 by Fallingcow (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:45PMRe:Bethesda's Spy-games by earnest murderer (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:39PM2 replies beneath your current threshold. Language Police... (Score:1) by yobtah (16795) on Wednesday November 09, @04:09PM (#13992199) Dude... "gigahertz" is not the plural of "gigahertz". [ Reply to ThisRe:Language Police... by ichigo 2.0 (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @04:19PMRe:Language Police... by MoriaOrc (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @04:30PMRe:Language Police... by pharwell (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:35PM This title was the "System Seller" (Score:5, Interesting) by popo (107611) on Wednesday November 09, @04:23PM (#13992314) Without Oblivion, XBOX 360 has no real "system seller".No Halo? no Oblivion? Perfect Dark Zero could be cool, but I don'tsee nearly the same level of excitement for it.I think this is going to have a huge impact on the bottom linefor initial Xbox sales.I don't know about everyone else here, but for me the first Xboxwas about Halo and Morrowind. [ Reply to ThisRe:This title was the "System Seller" by ilyaaohell (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:56PMRe:This title was the "System Seller" by CharonIDRONES (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:01PMRe:This title was the "System Seller" by Keeper (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:29PMRe:This title was the "System Seller" by PimpWilly (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:17PMRe:This title was the "System Seller" by Delphiki (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:30PMRe:This title was the "System Seller" by PimpWilly (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:34PMRe:This title was the "System Seller" by Delphiki (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @10:29PMRe:This title was the "System Seller" by Morinaga (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:10PMRe:This title was the "System Seller" by Mac Degger (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:34PMRe:This title was the "System Seller" by Jabroni_5000_Deluxe (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:44PMRe:This title was the "System Seller" by Mac Degger (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:50PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. That's nothing (Score:3, Insightful) by phasm42 (588479) on Wednesday November 09, @04:27PM (#13992356) Personally, I lost count at 175 hours in the current game, Elder Scrolls 3: Morrowind. Think about that for a second: that's 2 hours after work every day for 3 full months.Apparently this guy has never talked to an Evercrack fiend. [ Reply to ThisRe:That's nothing by SatanicPuppy (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:04PMRe:That's nothing by Derekloffin (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:11PMRe:That's nothing by TimeSpeak (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:37PMRe:That's nothing by Hakubi_Washu (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:23PMRe:That's nothing by patio11 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @08:05PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. bugs (Score:3, Funny) by Erpo (237853) <tint14@hotma i l . c om> on Wednesday November 09, @04:37PM (#13992487) good bandwidth to update and expandTranslation: We're really looking forward to releasing an unfinished game and (perhaps) patching the bugs as you find them. [ Reply to ThisRe:bugs by Keith Russell (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:14PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. Next-Gen, Riiiiight. (Score:2) by adam31 (817930) <`moc.liamg' `ta' `13mada'> on Wednesday November 09, @04:40PM (#13992525) We're locking the framerate at 30fps on the 360We don't do a lot with dynamic landscape changes beyond things like grass swaying in reaction to the weather.No cloth physics unfortunately. We found they are a huge sink for processing timeSo, wait. This game is 'next-gen'!? It sounds like all they did was port their pixel shaders to SM3.0 ...Now I'm sure the gameplay is great. But what are they doing with all the extra cycles? There just isn't an excuse to run 30fps any more. Just slapping some over-saturated bloom effects on the framebuffer doesn't cut it. [ Reply to ThisRe:Next-Gen, Riiiiight. by RingDev (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:58PMRe:Next-Gen, Riiiiight. by Keith Russell (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:36PMRe:Next-Gen, Riiiiight. by ikkonoishi (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:34PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:Next-Gen, Riiiiight. by ilyaaohell (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:00PMRe:Next-Gen, Riiiiight. by Mac Degger (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:39PMRe:Next-Gen, Riiiiight. by king-manic (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @09:23PMRe:Next-Gen, Riiiiight. by _Ludwig (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @10:29PMWelll... yeahhhh! by Imazalil (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:08PM Re:Next-Gen, Riiiiight. (Score:4, Informative) by vectorian798 (792613) on Wednesday November 09, @07:04PM (#13993790) Apparently you seem to know nothing about the game and just posted something half-assedly controversial to get modded up.The game has many novel features. First, every single NPC in the game has its own life cycle including eating meals, working, sleeping, idle activities (note that I said idle activities, not just idle actions such as those in Far Cry). This enhances the 'immersion' factor, which was a VERY big part of Morrowind. Oblivion takes place over a fairly large amount of land (the # of sq. mi. is at Oblivion's website), has a weather system, open-endedness that Morrowind had (feels a lot like Fallout in the sense that you have lots of stuff to do other than the 'main quest').The physics engine is awesome even without cloth physics. Trees, grass, arrows, etc. If you look at one of the gameplay videos here [ign.com] you will see a demo where the player character fires arrows into a bucket hanging from the ceiling or something, and the bucket sways and the row buckles etc. from the arrows hitting it. You can then walk up to the bucket, and you will notice that depending on how the arrows penetrated the wood in the bucket (angle, force, etc.), the bucket is tilting or perhaps moving slowly to a stop. When the player character removes the arrows from the bucket, the bucket moves to reflect each arrow you pull out, taking a different 'tilted' position or whatever as per physics. I don't know about you, but the job they did in modifying Havok is pretty damn good.Graphics: you have to be retarded if you think the game is just bloom effects. First, you might have noticed the large number of textures and colors in the world (in the cities for example). Graphics = technical quality (engine) + artwork (textures). Second, the tree generation (I believe they are using Speedtree like Gothic and Unreal 2007) is awesome, it actually feels like a forest instead of a few scattered trees with few leaves on them. Lastly, you may have noticed that the shader effects are present almost everywhere, whereas in Morrowind they were (mostly) confined to the water. There is soft-shadowing, self-soft-shadowing, and a host of other effects you would want in a tier-1 game as well.Sound: If you check out the videos I pointed above, you will hear some of the same songs that were in Morrowind. These songs are extremely well done, and conducive to the atmosphere of the game. Oblivion apparently has many more songs now, as expected, and an awesome all-star cast of narrators that really make characters come through more realistically.For those who enjoy games like Baldur's Gate, Fallout, or really any of the Black Isle works, Morrowind and Oblivion are a must-play. [ Reply to This | Parent2 replies beneath your current threshold. PC/XBOX360 simultaneous development? (Score:1) by eudas (192703) on Wednesday November 09, @05:09PM (#13992805) (http://www.kdi.com/~eudas/) It'll be interesting to see if the game play will be undesirably impacted due to decisions about how to accomodate the development for both PC and console, similarly to how Deus Ex: Invisible War was impacted.One would hope not, but unfortunately, those console dollars are mighty attractive these days.eudas [ Reply to ThisRe:PC/XBOX360 simultaneous development? by Bishop (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:16PMRe:PC/XBOX360 simultaneous development? by NCraig (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @08:18PM Interesting Thoughts on Threading (Score:2, Interesting) by jfmiller (119037) on Wednesday November 09, @05:24PM (#13992957) (http://slashdot.org/ | Last Journal: Tuesday December 09, @01:25AM) Gavin Carter: Oblivion will absolutely benefit from a multi-processor or multi-core PC architecture. These improvements have largely been driven by our optimizations for the Xbox 360 hardware. We have built a dynamic thread management system that manages processor load by our specific direction and by priorities. Portions of physics, AI, loading, audio, and rendering tasks can all be moved to different threads to keep the overall load balanced. The net result for the end user is a smoother experience. I think there are some interesting bits in this response. "We have built a dynamic thread management system" really caught my attention. I have read a number of recent articles [1 [arstechnica.com],2 [arstechnica.com]]talking about the need for multithread programming, and the difficulty of doing it. It seems to me that the ES4 team has not only embraced the idea of threading, but done so in what I think is a very logical manner. What I envision of a dynamic thread management system from the quote above seems to be what is needed in the next generation of applications. With clock speed giving way to more cores speed increases will need to come from running tasks in parallel. For a number of reasons that I will not go into here, threading by hand can is difficult to do safely, and in many cases ends up being premature optimization. On the other hand leaving threading to a compiler or even worse the CPU circuitry itself has been seen to be fairly ineffective. The human who writes an application is probably the one most qualified to find parallelism, but may not be the best one to implement it at the thread level.I envision that this system has allowed the different groups involved to create their distinct tasks and rules that govern how the tasks interact, but instead of trying to hand code that interaction, they have designed a system that does the dirty work of translating task interaction into thread logic for them. Additionally, this seems to be done on the fly so a system like the XBOX360 with 3 PPE cores can execute differently then a new PC with a multi core an AMD or INTEL cpu. It also would seem to allow program to adapt to the loads finds itself under.I for one would really like to hear more about the way this thing functions. In a post to one of the articles I referenced, I asked about the availability of programming paradigms that would abstract the concept of threads much as many languages now abstract the concept of memory allocation with "Garbage Collection." I didn't get much of a response. I'm hoping some Slashdot reader can fill me in on what is know about thread management systems.JFMILLERReferences: Wikipedia Entry: Threads [wikipedia.org] Ars Technica Article: Introduction to Multithreading, Superthreading and Hyperthreading [arstechnica.com] A threads FAQ from comp.programming.threads [serpentine.com] [ Reply to ThisRe:Interesting Thoughts on Threading by Hast (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @11:48PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. Man, that Xbox 360 must be cool (Score:3, Funny) by dghcasp (459766) on Wednesday November 09, @06:07PM (#13993350) I haven't followed all this stuff about the new Xbox, but I read this article because a cow-orker of mine has been raving about the Elder Scrolls series.From TFA: The Xbox 360 poses some unique challenges in the fact that it's half console, half PC, yet a generation above either of them in their current form. Man, a generation above current PC's! So what has it got?A Hexium processor instead of a Pentium processor?A 128 bit operating system?More than 64 Gb of memory?4000x3000 graphics? (run out through your 720x480 TV?)Terabyte ethernet?DTS2 audio with 18 channels at 192Kb/s per channel?A quantum processor?or is this standard journalists who don't understand quoting people who don't understand? [ Reply to ThisRe:Man, that Xbox 360 must be cool by Babbster (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @08:38PM2 replies beneath your current threshold. Re:Elder Scrolls (Score:4, Funny) by Availle (791304) <haslerNO@SPAMcs.tum.edu> on Wednesday November 09, @03:47PM (#13991957) I shouldn't even reply to this, but I'm a woman and I'm looking forward to this game. Yes, I take the occasional shower every day. And for all of the dirty D&D geeks out there, I already have a boyfriend. [ Reply to This | Parent Re:Elder Scrolls (Score:5, Funny) by DreadSpoon (653424) on Wednesday November 09, @03:56PM (#13992049) (http://www.awemud.net/ | Last Journal: Thursday April 24, @08:59PM) "And for all of the dirty D&D geeks out there, I already have a boyfriend."Ah, but one must ask, are his D20s big enough for you?(And there goes my "always respectful" track record.) [ Reply to This | ParentRe:Elder Scrolls by Availle (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:05PM Re:Elder Scrolls (Score:5, Funny) by DreadSpoon (653424) on Wednesday November 09, @04:30PM (#13992397) (http://www.awemud.net/ | Last Journal: Thursday April 24, @08:59PM) "If I comment on this, it might damage your ego."Possibly. But remember, it's not the size that counts... ... it's whether or not you can roll the crit hits.(Just digging my well of depravity even deeper, aren't I?) [ Reply to This | ParentRe:Elder Scrolls by ViX44 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:32PMRe:Elder Scrolls by Mac Degger (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:42PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. Re:Elder Scrolls (Score:4, Funny) by Sheepdot (211478) on Wednesday November 09, @04:23PM (#13992317) (Last Journal: Monday May 30, @01:21PM) I shouldn't have to say this, but your statement announcing you are "a woman" on Slashdot is akin to saying you're available and looking.So stating "I already have a boyfriend" only indicates to the rest of us that you're looking for a geekier one than you already have. [ Reply to This | ParentRe:Elder Scrolls by Gumber (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:51PMRe:Elder Scrolls by milimetric (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:53PM2 replies beneath your current threshold. Re:Elder Scrolls (Score:3, Funny) by sound+vision (884283) on Wednesday November 09, @03:59PM (#13992088) (Last Journal: Wednesday October 05, @04:23AM) I'm gay, you insensitive clod! [ Reply to This | Parent1 reply beneath your current threshold. Re:Elder Scrolls (Score:5, Funny) by wbren (682133) on Wednesday November 09, @04:10PM (#13992209) (http://www.google.com/) (Elder Scrolls) is for dirty D&D geeks that have no hope of ever talking to a woman - let alone touching one. That's just not true! One time I was at a strip club and a stripper fell down because she was wearing stilettos. Anyway, on the way down to the floor, the back of my hand brushed against her shoulder. So yeah, we touch girls ALL THE TIME!!! [ Reply to This | Parent1 reply beneath your current threshold. Re:Observations (Score:3, Funny) by Digital Vomit (891734) on Wednesday November 09, @04:27PM (#13992355) (http://www.kaejae-worx.com/~don/index.htm | Last Journal: Tuesday October 04, @08:17AM) In the video, we see that digital dogs haven't progressed much. Just like in Deus Ex, when a dog turns, it magically spins about it's center. I have a dog, she doesn't turn like that. My dog does that. What kind did you get? [ Reply to This | Parent Re:Observations (Score:3, Informative) by Zed2K (313037) on Wednesday November 09, @04:37PM (#13992486) If the only experience with HDR you have is screenshots then you have no ground to stand on. Its one of those things that looks so much better in motion. [ Reply to This | ParentRe:Observations by Fallingcow (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:48PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.10 replies beneath your current threshold.

cryptocom writes "Space.com is reporting that two scientists at NASA are proposing using a 20-ton spacecraft to pull asteroids off a possible collision course with Earth, using the spacecraft's own gravity as an attractor. This idea would not only be cheaper, but have a much higher chance of success, due to not having to actually land on the asteroid's surface."Ads_xl=0;Ads_yl=0;Ads_xp='';Ads_yp='';Ads_xp1='';Ads_yp1='';Ads_par='';Ads_cnturl='';Ads_prf='page=article';Ads_channels='RON_P6_IMU';Ads_wrd='space,tech';Ads_kid=0;Ads_bid=0;Ads_sec=0; Using Gravity To Tow Asteroids Log in/Create an Account | Top | 438 comments (Spill at 50!) | Index Only | Search Discussion Display Options Threshold: -1: 438 comments 0: 435 comments 1: 368 comments 2: 241 comments 3: 49 comments 4: 25 comments 5: 19 comments Flat Nested No Comments Threaded Oldest First Newest First Highest Scores First Oldest First (Ignore Threads) Newest First (Ignore Threads) The Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way. (1) | 2 The mother of all asteroid deflection devices (Score:5, Insightful) by nizo (81281) * on Wednesday November 09, @04:24PM (#13992329) (Last Journal: Wednesday November 09, @02:42PM) Assuming:2000 lbs in a ton20 ton spacecraft$10,000/pound to get to geosynchronous transfer orbit$400,000,000 just to launch this thing into a geosynchronous transfer orbit (not counting construction costs). I assume the fuel to move it isn't included in the 20 ton estimate either (since it will burn off on the way) so that would need to be lifted as well. I wonder if a huge nuke would be cheaper and easier to construct and launch? Then again, with the current U.S. national debt at over 8 trillion (with which we could pay for the launch costs of 20,000 of these things) maybe the launch costs aren't unreasonable. [ Reply to This that's what i was thinking (Score:4, Interesting) by conJunk (779958) on Wednesday November 09, @04:26PM (#13992349) Right on. While it's really an elegant solution, highly cool, I imagine there is an asteroid-size pile of kinks to work out before this becomes reality though.Launching the craft. How much fuel would it take to get escape velocity on something this massive? Probably not a small amount.The crew. The time the crew would be away from earth would be how long? 10 years? 20 years? Managing and provisioning crews for such a long amount of time is probably among the major challenges facing the extension of our space travel abilities.Coming home. What happens when a ship this large is re-entering Earth's atmosphere? That sucker will have a lot of force coming down.Would it work? How do you test something like this before sinking billions into the final product and subsequent launch? what if it didn't work? What kind of contingency plans could we have?Shelf life. So we make a ginormous space tractor. Maybe we don't face an asteroid threat for 15,000 years. That's a lot of upkeep.who pays for it? This would turn into what, a trillion USD project? Who's footing that bill? What kind of bickering will we get in to breaking up those kinds of costs among dozens of nations?All in all, I think it's a brilliant solution that just may not be feasable, but it's nice to see creative people are thinking about it. [ Reply to This | ParentRe:that's what i was thinking by jabelar (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:32PMRe:that's what i was thinking by Wog (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @05:34PMRe:that's what i was thinking by mstromb (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:04PMRe:that's what i was thinking by Impy the Impiuos Imp (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:11PMRe:that's what i was thinking by hamilton76 (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:12PMRe:that's what i was thinking by CardiganKiller (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:09PMRe:that's what i was thinking by peculiarmethod (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:33PMRe:that's what i was thinking by Rei (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @04:43PMRe:that's what i was thinking by jx100 (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @04:52PMRe:that's what i was thinking by Rei (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:23PMRe:that's what i was thinking by Anonymous Coward (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:36PMRe:that's what i was thinking by Rei (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:20PMRe:that's what i was thinking by drinkypoo (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:24PMRe:that's what i was thinking by Impy the Impiuos Imp (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:15PMRe:that's what i was thinking by Rei (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @08:09PMRe:that's what i was thinking by Rei (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @08:12PM Re:that's what i was thinking (Score:5, Insightful) by Rei (128717) on Wednesday November 09, @04:33PM (#13992442) (http://www.cursor.org/) Crew? Not a chance. There is absolutely no reason to send crew on a mission like this. It would just complicate a mission that computer controls could already do more than well enough, and send the price through the roof. We're already doing completely automated asteroid *landings* (harder than it sounds, because they have very irregular gravity fields). There's no way that the 20 tonnes includes a human payload and all of the associated baggage.No humans, no coming home. Also, they mention 20 years prep time - i.e., they're not planning to build it until a threat is discovered, and the couple billion dollar cost would be amortized over that time to perhaps 100 mil per year, split around the world's space agencies. I'm sure that's more than enough time and low enough cost. Also, a 200 meter asteroid is hardly a worldwide cataclysmic event if it hits; it's like a single large nuclear weapon hitting a random place on the planet, if you can trust the impact calculator [arizona.edu]. [ Reply to This | ParentHumans perhaps.... by isotope23 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:47PM Re:Humans perhaps.... (Score:5, Insightful) by Rei (128717) on Wednesday November 09, @05:18PM (#13992902) (http://www.cursor.org/) I often refer people to look at unmanned Mars missions, and determine how many of the huge number of failed Mars missions could have been saved by people. The answer is almost none. Most were booster failures, calculation errors (which humans couldn't have noticed until it was too late), failures in critical hardware, even explosive depressurization of pressurized parts (and you better believe that you have a lot more pressurized area with people!). Only two in which the computer was shut down but recoverable could realistically have been saved by humans. On the other hand, one of the missions which was salvaged likely would have killed any human crew onboard; a solar panel used for aerobraking at Mars was damaged, and they had to make it take many months longer to get into Mars orbit. This would have been fatal to the crew (unless they were equipped to do spacewalks and metal repairs, which raises the price and complexity even further).Adding humans will around 20x your cost. So, take your pick: 20 completely different designs, or one manned mission with a significant chance of failure, for the same price. It's a pretty simple call; there's a reason why almost all probes that we launch are unmanned. The manned space program gets funding. The unmanned space program does the research. [ Reply to This | Parent Re:Humans perhaps.... (Score:5, Insightful) by isotope23 (210590) on Wednesday November 09, @05:30PM (#13993018) (http://newlibertarian.blogspot.com/ | Last Journal: Monday July 18, @02:23PM) Yeah but don't you think there will be a boatload of people screamingabout an unmanned mission if the fate of the world hangs in the balance?From a political point of view I can't see anyone supporting a robot probemission to save the earth. [ Reply to This | ParentRe:Humans perhaps.... by agrippa_cash (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @06:30PMRe:Humans perhaps.... by Meetch (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @07:41PMRe:Humans perhaps.... by YA_Python_dev (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @08:13PMRe:Humans perhaps.... by Rei (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:11PMRe:Humans perhaps.... by Lord Ender (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @09:43PMRe:Humans perhaps.... by snuf23 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @09:44PM2 replies beneath your current threshold.Re:Humans perhaps.... by robertjw (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:55PMRe:Humans perhaps.... by Rei (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:08PMRe:Humans perhaps.... by ChrisA90278 (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:14PMRe:Humans perhaps.... by nizo (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:30PMRe:Humans perhaps.... by liquidpele (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:49PMMass produce rovers. by crovira (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:58PMRe:Humans perhaps.... by Impy the Impiuos Imp (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:24PMRe:Humans perhaps.... by Rei (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @08:14PMRe:that's what i was thinking by NelsonM (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @04:54PMRe:that's what i was thinking by ENOENT (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:03PMRe:that's what i was thinking by letxa2000 (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:24PMRe:that's what i was thinking by stlhawkeye (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @06:02PMRe:that's what i was thinking by neuro.slug (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:09PMSlashdot title should read by Propaganda13 (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:17PMOh come now.... by carlmenezes (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:11PMRe:that's what i was thinking by Impy the Impiuos Imp (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:20PMRe:that's what i was thinking by MaskedSlacker (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:32PMRe:that's what i was thinking by Rei (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:43PMRe:that's what i was thinking by MaskedSlacker (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:52PMRe:that's what i was thinking by Rei (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @08:22PMRe:that's what i was thinking by MaskedSlacker (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @09:03PMRe:that's what i was thinking by Bad D.N.A. (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @09:11PMRe:that's what i was thinking by NitsujTPU (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @09:24PMMaybe somebody should RTFA? by RabidMoose (Score:1) Thursday November 10, @12:18AMRe:that's what i was thinking by Desert Raven (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @04:36PMRe:that's what i was thinking by conJunk (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:42PMRe:that's what i was thinking by BlogPope (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:16PMRe:that's what i was thinking by liquidpele (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:43PMRe:that's what i was thinking by rufty_tufty (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:29PMRe:that's what i was thinking by Eccles (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @08:04PMRe:that's what i was thinking by Hrvat (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @04:38PMRe:that's what i was thinking by mtaht (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @04:39PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:that's what i was thinking by MindStalker (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:39PMRe:that's what i was thinking by dakirw (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @08:39PMSalvage one had the right idea by ankarbass (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:40PMRe:that's what i was thinking by AviLazar (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:00PMMods on crack? by StarKruzr (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:17PMRe:that's what i was thinking by Jerry Coffin (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:10PMGood use for Project Orion by CustomDesigned (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:31PM Re:that's what i was thinking (Score:5, Informative) by SteveAyre (209812) <sa146.cs@york@ac@uk> on Wednesday November 09, @06:52PM (#13993707) Launching the craft. How much fuel would it take to get escape velocity on something this massive? Probably not a small amount.20 ton spaceship. That's actually smaller than the Space Shuttle.I can't remember the source now, but the Shuttle can lift about a 30ton payload. The boosters themselves can lift far more but of course have to carry the Shuttle too (which is something like 120tons).The Saturn V rocket [wikipedia.org] was capable of lifting 118 tonnes (with the 3 stage versions).The Shuttle Derived Launch Vehicle [wikipedia.org] will have a capacity of 125 tonnes.All seem plenty to lift a 20ton spaceship if it's the only thing being launched. Even with a Shuttle it should be doable, or we can have another up there waiting to deploy it or use the ISS team.Since we're able to use existing launchers to get the spaceship into orbit, it shouldn't cost any more to launch than any existing mission. All your left with is the pricetag for building it and giving it enough fuel to reach the asteroid.The crew. The time the crew would be away from earth would be how long? 10 years? 20 years? Managing and provisioning crews for such a long amount of time is probably among the major challenges facing the extension of our space travel abilities.Coming home. What happens when a ship this large is re-entering Earth's atmosphere? That sucker will have a lot of force coming down.Due to the distance it would have to travel a robotic mission remote controlled from Earth would make the most sense. Just in case anything breaks which isn't workaroundable/fixable it would probably make sense to send more than one.In this case it'd be best to leave it out there - without enough fuel to return it'd be cheaper and without a crew to bring home there's no real reason to.Shelf life. So we make a ginormous space tractor. Maybe we don't face an asteroid threat for 15,000 years. That's a lot of upkeep.The launchers are already around, and it wouldn't take long to build a ship which is essentially a remote controlled engine with a lot of metal attached.Assuming that we'd know of the threat in enough time to send this to the asteroid, as long as we still have the launchers to get it into space in the first place it shouldn't be unreasonable that we can build them as we need them.If we don't have that kind of timescale then we're probably in trouble even if we could send it straight away. Since the launchers seem capable of lifting more than 20 tonnes though, we could just build a 40 tonne version and half the time we'd need (disclaimer: not linear, i think it'd be more like 3/4?). [ Reply to This | ParentRe:that's what i was thinking by hurfy (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @08:35PMRe:that's what i was thinking by jim_v2000 (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @07:52PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. Re:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices (Score:5, Funny) by lightyear4 (852813) on Wednesday November 09, @04:28PM (#13992367) (http://www.fugitivethought.com/steve/blog.php) I don't think you should place a price upon the value of saving civilization. [ Reply to This | ParentRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by CyricZ (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:29PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by svkal (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:07PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by FidelCatsro (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:27PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by Impy the Impiuos Imp (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:35PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by Rei (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:30PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by Impy the Impiuos Imp (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:31PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by myowntrueself (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @09:34PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by richdun (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @04:30PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by MilenCent (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @08:24PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by ozydingo (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:36PM Re:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices (Score:5, Insightful) by tji (74570) on Wednesday November 09, @04:43PM (#13992567) (http://www.weaselworkz.com) > I don't think you should place a price upon the value of saving civilization.That's silly.. The goal is "saving civilization". There are many ways to accomplish this goal, a perfectly valid input into the decision process is "how much does this method cost". [ Reply to This | ParentRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by macklin01 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:55PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by nizo (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:36PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by iamlucky13 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @08:10PMOf course by Jeff Molby (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:11PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by misleb (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:03PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by e2ka (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:11PMDumb ideas... by Cunjo (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:36PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by fm6 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:18PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by Impy the Impiuos Imp (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:37PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by idlake (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:35PM3 replies beneath your current threshold. Re:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices (Score:5, Funny) by Gulthek (12570) on Wednesday November 09, @04:28PM (#13992370) (http://www.stephenball.net/ | Last Journal: Thursday April 25, @09:03PM) Maybe to stop a huge asteroid from impacting on the Earth's surface the cost would be quite reasonable.I.e. I don't think that world leaders would look at the figures and go "Hrmmmmm...when you say extinct...how extinct?" [ Reply to This | Parent Re:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices (Score:4, Funny) by AnonymousKev (754127) on Wednesday November 09, @05:28PM (#13993006) > I.e. I don't think that world leaders would look at the figures and go "Hrmmmmm...when you say extinct...how extinct?"You've obviously never been in a scheduling meeting with management. [ Reply to This | ParentRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by Chapter80 (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:45PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by Chapter80 (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:58PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by KylePflug (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:17PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by Impy the Impiuos Imp (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:39PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by iamlucky13 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @08:26PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by Anonymous Coward (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @04:28PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by B3ryllium (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:47PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by tradiuz (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @04:31PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by ozydingo (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @04:41PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by stfvon007 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:26PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by Tatarize (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:44PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by kzarling (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:16PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by nizo (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:39PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by HarvardAce (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:48PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by Tatarize (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:54PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by Impy the Impiuos Imp (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:42PMor just pick some boulders on the target asteroid by njchick (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:23PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by B3ryllium (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:50PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by daniil (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:31PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Up out of the well? by FlyingOrca (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:32PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by Daveznet (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:32PM Re:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices (Score:5, Insightful) by stienman (51024) <<adavis> <at> <ubasics.com>> on Wednesday November 09, @04:48PM (#13992603) (http://www.ubasics.com/adam | Last Journal: Wednesday August 06, @01:01PM) You cannot put a price on human life! Nonsense. In fact, there's a whole work force [soa.org] employed to do exactly that. -Adam [ Reply to This | ParentRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by Mr. Slippery (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:04PMbah by toiletmonster (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:29PMIt sure pissed people off when you by Ogemaniac (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:24PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by trurl7 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:53PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by Impy the Impiuos Imp (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:44PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by trurl7 (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:08PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by mtaht (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:34PM Re:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices (Score:5, Funny) by GryMor (88799) on Wednesday November 09, @05:14PM (#13992870) 'Hoovering' isn't going to work, suction is just the difference between a high presure area and a low presure area. In order to 'hoover' in this environment you would need to have a zone inside the space craft with a presure lower than the presure outside the spacecraft. The presure outside the spacecraft is aproximately 0, so, good luck with creating an area of negative pressure (which would require a negative number of atoms, a negative absolute temperature or a negative volume...) [ Reply to This | ParentRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by mtaht (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:38PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by mtaht (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:49PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by 0xABADC0DA (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:37PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by Mahou (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @04:38PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by geomon (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:43PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by Mahou (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:52PMSpace Junk by arrrrg (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @04:40PMRe:Space Junk by cyclopropene (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:21PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by slashdotnickname (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:43PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by adavies42 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:44PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by vertinox (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:50PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by Wog (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:32PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by nihilogos (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:51PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by xikzantric (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:53PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by JesseL (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @04:55PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by modecx (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:29PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by hwyengr (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:32PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by JesseL (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @09:21PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by drinkypoo (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:20PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by JesseL (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @09:14PMDon't rely on the mother by misleb (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:08PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by P3NIS_CLEAVER (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:09PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by Em Adespoton (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:13PMNot unprecidented by pavon (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @05:19PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by maxwells_deamon (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:28PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by hosecoat (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:38PMHow much is that in terms of bears? by LoverOfJoy (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:38PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by eclectro (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:42PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by pyrrho (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:46PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by bcattwoo (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:46PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by bcattwoo (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:49PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by bcrowell (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:51PM$400,000,000? Goverment Spending.... by rubberbando (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:51PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by dada21 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:56PMIt doesn't have to be 20 tonnes of Earth by whitehatlurker (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:01PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by CuriosityKilledWHAT (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:04PMAre you kidding? by cdrguru (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:04PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by Nosajjason (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:06PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by Rorschach1 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:07PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by bogado (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:15PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by Pyromage (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:18PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by Pollardito (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:35PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by HermanAB (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:37PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by Impy the Impiuos Imp (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:01PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by yellowstone (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:14PMIs it necessary to launch 20 tons? by Julian Morrison (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:15PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by way2trivial (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:44PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by mikael (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:48PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by Junior J. Junior III (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @08:44PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by Xyrus (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @08:59PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by stoothman (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @09:42PMI got a better idea by cybermint (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @09:47PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by Don Sample (Score:1) Thursday November 10, @12:20AMRe:The mother of all asteroid ATTRACTION devices by HD Webdev (Score:2) Thursday November 10, @12:23AMCompare with current shuttle by tm2b (Score:2) Thursday November 10, @12:28AMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by stecoop (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:30PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by Kaenneth (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:47PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by Toxicgonzo (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @04:56PMRe:Bad math? by Psyonic (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:04PMRe:Bad math? by echosilex (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:06PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by bob_herrick (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:48PMRe:The mother of all asteroid deflection devices by chriso11 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @08:59PM13 replies beneath your current threshold.20 Ton Tractor by geomon (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @04:24PMRe:20 Ton Tractor by theJML (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:31PM How exciting, sort of (Score:5, Funny) by phpm0nkey (768038) * on Wednesday November 09, @04:25PM (#13992336) (http://www.namefuse.com/) "The kind of spacecraft we've talked about could move an asteroid 650 feet (200 meters) across provided we have decades of advanced warning," Neat... although, if this works, it will totally kill the Hollywood "asteroid catastrophe" genre. The concept of sitting a giant hunk of metal next to an asteroid for 20 years to gradually shift its path doesn't exactly make for fast-paced, high-tension action movie fare. [ Reply to ThisRe:How exciting, sort of by FooAtWFU (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:27PMRe:How exciting, sort of by Mahou (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @04:47PMRe:How exciting, sort of by Joe the Lesser (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:33PMUntil the 20 ton hunk of metal pulls a "Skylab" by StressGuy (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:35PM Advanced warning (Score:5, Insightful) by EmbeddedJanitor (597831) on Wednesday November 09, @04:35PM (#13992466) Considering the number of asteroids etc that only get seen on the way out, asking for decades of warning is perhaps unrealistic. [ Reply to This | ParentRe:Advanced warning by Idarubicin (Score:2) Thursday November 10, @12:06AMRe:How exciting, sort of by Toxicgonzo (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:40PMRe:How exciting, sort of by wgaryhas (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:32PMRe:How exciting, sort of by Phwoar (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @08:11PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Nah - all you need is.... by lightyear4 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:00PMRe:How exciting, sort of by bmalia (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:32PMYou insensitive clod. by hwyengr (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:35PMRe:How exciting, sort of by LoverOfJoy (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:44PMRe:How exciting, sort of by 14erCleaner (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:50PMNo, but what would make a great movie... by eyebits (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:50PMSure it does. by geekoid (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:26PMRe:How exciting, sort of by nra1871 (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:07PMThe movie Armageddon by GuyWhoPosts (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:30PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.1 reply beneath your current threshold.They only have one small problem to solve by Anonymous Coward (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:26PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.It's all relative by BigDawgES (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @04:27PMRe:It's all relative by Seiruu (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @04:30PM Interesting, but slow (Score:5, Interesting) by Rei (128717) on Wednesday November 09, @04:27PM (#13992363) (http://www.cursor.org/) Interesting proposal, although the rate of towing still seems a concern if it takes a year to tow a 200 meter asteroid the small amount needed to make it miss Earth, with 20 years prep time required. Hopefully there aren't too many asteroids much larger than that which aren't currently tracked, but you never know.If they're concerned about the amount of impulse delivered by a direct nuclear weapon impact, why not a series of projectile impacts (or at-a-distance, low impulse nuclear detonations)? While you'd have to launch more payload into space, the prep time would certainly seem to be far lower. [ Reply to ThisGood cartoon stuff I suppose by tinkerton (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:22PMRe:Good cartoon stuff I suppose by Rei (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:28PMRe:Good cartoon stuff I suppose by delphi125 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:16PMRe:Good cartoon stuff I suppose by Rei (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:33PMRe:Good cartoon stuff I suppose by ndinsil (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @11:37PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.What? by voice_of_all_reason (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @04:28PMI'd say so! by pegr (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:29PM It's been awhile since I've taken physics... (Score:5, Interesting) by jkauzlar (596349) * on Wednesday November 09, @04:29PM (#13992381) (http://www.whitehouse.gov/~jkauzlar) but since it seemed strange to me that a 20 ton object could possess any considerable gravitational force I did a quick calculation, with a lot of rounding, to determine the force between the 20-ton object (~18150 kg) and the fourth largest asteroid Hygiea [aas.org] which has a mass of about 9x10^19 kg. My result, for a distance of 1 kilometer between the spacecraft and the asteriod, was 10^8 Newtons of force.So comes the hard part of determining how far out the spacecraft would have to meet the asteriod and glide along beside it so as to veer the asteroid to a safe range of R kilometers from Earth. Any ideas? [ Reply to ThisRe:It's been awhile since I've taken physics... by Xentor (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:41PMRe:It's been awhile since I've taken physics... by jkauzlar (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:03PMRe:It's been awhile since I've taken physics... by Surt (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:18PMRe:It's been awhile since I've taken physics... by greginnj (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:51PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:It's been awhile since I've taken physics... by MindStalker (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @04:58PM Re:It's been awhile since I've taken physics... (Score:5, Informative) by twiddlingbits (707452) on Wednesday November 09, @04:59PM (#13992715) Wouldn't that would be 10^8 Newtons of force pulling the spacecraft toward the asteriod? The asteriod is much more massive and would have a gravity well of it's own. Wouldn't that attractice force have to be overcome for 20 yrs, plus a slight acceleration in the direction the asteroid needed to move? The 20 ton spacecraft would have a higher force of gravity on the 'roid than that of the Sun for 20 yrs (or however long the tractor lasts) so it could gradually change to orbit, How do we make things that can stay in space for 20 yrs w/o repair? How do you get that much fuel on-board? Solar Cells are not an option that far from the Sun. A nuclear reactor maybe but they would have all sorts of issues there, even if the "tractor" was not launched from Earth, the fission elements would have to be launched as I don't think you find Uranium just floating in space. And heaven forbid someone mis-calculates and they push it onto a collission course..they it takes another 20 yrs to fix that! This article sure makes a LOT of assumptions and figure on new ideas/technologies we don't have. It is a neat idea but IMHO it belongs under the topic of Science Fiction not in a journal like Nature. [ Reply to This | ParentRe:It's been awhile since I've taken physics... by zippthorne (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @10:06PMRe:It's been awhile since I've taken physics... by twiddlingbits (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @11:55PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.

csplinter writes write to tell us that SuSE Linux founder Hubert Mantel has resigned from Novell stating "Too late for me. I just decided to leave Suse/Novell. This is no longer the company I founded 13 years ago." Novell confirmed his resignation but had little else to say on the topic. From the article: "Mantel's departure also comes less than a week after Novell announced a major restructuring that would result in 600 layoffs. It's unclear if Mantel's resignation is related to the restructuring." Suse Linux Founder Exits Novell Log in/Create an Account | Top | 193 comments | Search Discussion Display Options Threshold: -1: 193 comments 0: 189 comments 1: 147 comments 2: 104 comments 3: 40 comments 4: 19 comments 5: 12 comments Flat Nested No Comments Threaded Oldest First Newest First Highest Scores First Oldest First (Ignore Threads) Newest First (Ignore Threads) The Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way. 13 years for what (Score:2) by visionsofmcskill (556169) <vision@gBALDWINetmp.com minus author> on Wednesday November 09, @05:06PM (#13992772) (http://www.getmp.com/ | Last Journal: Monday November 18, @12:11PM) Its a tough week for novell when they loose botha founder and 600 employees.... makes you wonder just who is using their solutions anymore? [ Reply to ThisRe:13 years for what by Amouth (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @05:11PM Re:13 years for what (Score:5, Interesting) by Reducer2001 (197985) <jasonfischer@nOspAM.gmail.com> on Wednesday November 09, @05:22PM (#13992944) Perhaps you meant to say that administrators who have Novell solutions in place don't have anything to do? My company has NetWare servers for file/print/auth/e-mail/Internet proxy/etc. in place. Our servers have uptimes in the 100's of days (our best record was 438 days until the mobo died) and require almost no upkeep. Not to mention that I don't have to worry too much about nasty viruses coming in. Oh, and our NetWare servers have a bash prompt that I can use, as well as running several OSS programs (Apache, PHP, MySQL). [ Reply to This | ParentRe:13 years for what by Amouth (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:10PMRe:13 years for what by ekwhite (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @10:36PMRe:13 years for what by PygmySurfer (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @11:49PMRe:13 years for what by Scott7477 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @10:38PMRe:13 years for what by toofast (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @10:48PMRe:13 years for what by schon (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:46PMRe:13 years for what by Amouth (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:13PM3 replies beneath your current threshold.Re:13 years for what by KilobyteKnight (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:12PM Re:13 years for what (Score:5, Interesting) by krgallagher (743575) on Wednesday November 09, @05:22PM (#13992937) (http://www.krgallagher.com/) "I love Suse. It's my favorite distro by far." Same here. I really do not understand staements like "This is no longer the company I founded 13 years ago." Of course it isn't. It is Novel. Novel is an old corporation with a well known corporate culture. Mantel knew that when he sold the company. If he had any illusions, he was just deluding himself. I think the most telling quote in the article is "I'm very confident the Novell management will find a competent successor very quickly. After all, there are lots of extremely skilled people over there in the Ximian division." Sounds to me like corporate infighting and Mantel lost. [ Reply to This | Parent Re:13 years for what (Score:4, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 09, @05:27PM (#13993000) Yes, especially since kernel development is not exactly Ximians forte. This is probably a clash between company cultures. German engineers believe that quality matters while american managers know that playing golf with executives is more important. [ Reply to This | ParentRe:13 years for what by penguinrenegade (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:46PMXimian does kernel stuff by r00t (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @09:13PM Re:13 years for what (Score:5, Insightful) by ScriptedReplay (908196) on Wednesday November 09, @06:22PM (#13993489) Same here. I really do not understand staements like "This is no longer the company I founded 13 years ago." Of course it isn't. It is Novel.This is SuSE's *founder* that you're talking about. Meaning he had a *vision* for his company which, from his quote, just isn't there anymore.Sounds to me like corporate infighting and Mantel lost.Of course it does - and that's probably what it is, too. The question is, however, *what did he lost to*? Now, if you look at the quote more closely, he's saying 'those smart guys from Ximian will pick up on kernel maintenance in no time' - which is of course untrue (at least the 'no time' part, although I suspect whoever will end up in his place will most likely *not* be coming from the desktop division) and to me it sounds like a veiled accusation that the Ximian guys pushed agendas in areas they had little clue about. Maybe I'm reading too much into this, but it does not sound that implausible in the light of recent evolutions at Novell that 'loud' was preferred to 'clueful' [ Reply to This | ParentRe:13 years for what by Zemran (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @09:32PMRe:13 years for what by donscarletti (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @11:44PMRe:13 years for what by LordMaxxon (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @10:53PMRe:13 years for what by Sir Joltalot (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @11:09PM2 replies beneath your current threshold.Re:13 years for what by Stephen Samuel (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @07:49PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:13 years for what by TrekCycling (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:27PMRe:13 years for what by chronicon (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @09:26PMRe:13 years for what by Miguelito (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @05:53PMRe:13 years for what by Phishcast (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:39PMRe:13 years for what by DTC-Bob (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:47PMRe:13 years for what by vawlk (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:39PM "Too Late"? (Score:4, Interesting) by adavies42 (746183) on Wednesday November 09, @05:06PM (#13992774) What is the "too late for me" in reference to? TFA give no clue. [ Reply to ThisRe:"Too Late"? by cloudmaster (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:11PM Re:"Too Late"? (Score:5, Insightful) by ElGuapoGolf (600734) on Wednesday November 09, @05:12PM (#13992850) (http://www.buildhigh.com/) I'm not sure what the "too late" comment means, but I think he takes a shot at some of the ximian folks later on when he suggests a maintainer for the SuSE kernel could be found from somewhere in the Ximian group.Ouch. I mean, given the bloated (but usable) mess that is Evolution, would you want those guys maintaining your distribution's kernel?I think he's right, SuSE isn't the same company anymore. Kubuntu, here I come. [ Reply to This | ParentRe:"Too Late"? by mbanck (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:51PMRe:"Too Late"? by AhaIndia (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @09:43PMRe:"Too Late"? by blair1q (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @11:13PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:"Too Late"? by gad_zuki! (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:59PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. Novell moves to GNOME; SuSE founder resigns? (Score:3, Insightful) by Srdjant (650988) on Wednesday November 09, @05:11PM (#13992837) Could Hubert Mantel have quit due to Novell making SuSE a GNOME-centred distro instead of keeping it a KDE-centred one?Novell standardise on GNOME: http://linux.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=05/11/05/ 1620206&tid=223&tid=106 [slashdot.org] [ Reply to This Re:Novell moves to GNOME; SuSE founder resigns? (Score:5, Interesting) by civilizedINTENSITY (45686) on Wednesday November 09, @05:22PM (#13992946) The comment about finding a kernel maintainer was likewise interesting:"I have been the maintainer of the Suse kernel for more than a decade now," Mantel wrote. "I'm very confident the Novell management will find a competent successor very quickly. After all, there are lots of extremely skilled people over there in the Ximian division."It is enough to make one wonder if there is a power struggle, or at least the perception of one, arising from differences of opinion between the SuSE and Ximian groups. SuSE's technical excellence is perhaps not so appreciated as some feel it should be? How important is mono? [ Reply to This | Parent Re:Novell moves to GNOME; SuSE founder resigns? (Score:4, Interesting) by Arandir (19206) on Wednesday November 09, @06:53PM (#13993716) (http://www.usermode.org/ | Last Journal: Sunday September 04, @07:28PM) To me, that sounds like subtle (or not so subtle) sarcasm. Perhaps Mantel heard the phrase "lots of extremely skilled people over there in the Ximian division" used one too many times as an excuse by his bosses, that he simply used it back at them.After all, if you have a division of perfect people down the hall, why not let them work on the kernel? Even if they're applications people with absolutely no kernel experience, how hard can it be for perfect people who have all the answers? [ Reply to This | ParentRe:Novell moves to GNOME; SuSE founder resigns? by ambrosius27 (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:49PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:Novell moves to GNOME; SuSE founder resigns? by oever (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @05:35PMRe:Novell moves to GNOME; SuSE founder resigns? by DAldredge (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:38PMRe:Novell moves to GNOME; SuSE founder resigns? by oever (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:46PMRe:Novell moves to GNOME; SuSE founder resigns? by DAldredge (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:54PMRe:Novell moves to GNOME; SuSE founder resigns? by oever (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:06PMRe:Novell moves to GNOME; SuSE founder resigns? by DAldredge (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:20PMTrollTech has made fantastic contributions. by CyricZ (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:39PMRe:TrollTech has made fantastic contributions. by markhb (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @09:55PMRe:Novell moves to GNOME; SuSE founder resigns? by Gentlewhisper (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:25PMRe:Novell moves to GNOME; SuSE founder resigns? by paugq (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @06:14PMRe:Novell moves to GNOME; SuSE founder resigns? by Anonymous Coward (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @08:41PMRe:Novell moves to GNOME; SuSE founder resigns? by CyricZ (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:15PMRe:Novell moves to GNOME; SuSE founder resigns? by DAldredge (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:22PMRe:Novell moves to GNOME; SuSE founder resigns? by CyricZ (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:29PMRe:Novell moves to GNOME; SuSE founder resigns? by DAldredge (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:56PMRe:Novell moves to GNOME; SuSE founder resigns? by Jason Earl (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:15PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:Novell moves to GNOME; SuSE founder resigns? by Waffle Iron (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @06:16PM2 replies beneath your current threshold. Novell is going the RedHat way (Score:1) by lonesometrainer (138112) <vanlil AT yahoo DOT com> on Wednesday November 09, @05:15PM (#13992874) Like RedHat with Fedora, Novell looks for Community backup with their OpenSuse.org project.Their best option will be a profitable enterprise-linux distribution with _zero_ community backup.They're making the life of all those shuttleworths' out there extremely easy.Not good. [ Reply to ThisRe:Novell is going the RedHat way by cloudmaster (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:19PMRe:Novell is going the RedHat way by talksinmaths (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:59PMRe:Novell is going the RedHat way by cloudmaster (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:21PMRe:Novell is going the RedHat way by div_2n (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:01PMRe:Novell is going the RedHat way by cloudmaster (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @11:51PMRe:Novell is going the RedHat way by talksinmaths (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:12PMRe:Novell is going the RedHat way by cloudmaster (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @11:56PMNo by RedNovember (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:30PMRe:No by AvitarX (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:46PMRe:Novell is going the RedHat way by nine-times (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:51PMRe:Novell is going the RedHat way by rm69990 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:59PM Time to Fork Suse (Score:3, Interesting) by Bruha (412869) on Wednesday November 09, @05:16PM (#13992882) (http://www.silentbrouhaha.com/ | Last Journal: Saturday July 31, @07:42AM) Novell promised big things for Suse 10. Claiming it was a Windows Killer. I find it no better or worse than the last version of Suse 9.What Novell is doing here is creating a platform for Ximian and the only way to get any distro to accept Ximian was to buy Suse. This apparently has proven true with Hubert's comments that Ximian had lots of talented people. [ Reply to ThisRe:Time to Fork Suse by DAldredge (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:21PMRe:Time to Fork Suse by daeley (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @05:38PMRe:Time to Fork Suse by rm69990 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:02PMRe:Time to Fork Suse by daeley (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:13PMRe:Time to Fork Suse by RedNovember (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:02PMRe:Time to Fork Suse by Software (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:02PMProof? by alandd (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @05:54PM who is it unclear to? (Score:5, Funny) by frovingslosh (582462) on Wednesday November 09, @05:16PM (#13992889) It's unclear if Mantel's resignation is related to the restructuring. Who is it unclear to? And what are they smoking? [ Reply to ThisRe:who is it unclear to? by AkaXakA (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:09PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. Especially... (Score:5, Funny) by alamandrax (692121) on Wednesday November 09, @05:18PM (#13992904) (http://thisisnotfrozenfish.blogspot.com/ | Last Journal: Tuesday May 11, @03:20AM) When we took away his stapler. That just pissed him off. [ Reply to ThisRe:Especially... by Robocoastie (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:02PMRe:How is that "insightful"?! by alamandrax (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:36PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. The question for Novell is... (Score:1, Insightful) by Hymer (856453) on Wednesday November 09, @05:19PM (#13992913) Is SuSE without Hubert Mantel a SuSE people want ? [ Reply to ThisRe:The question for Novell is... by TrekCycling (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @05:33PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. My Bet (Score:4, Insightful) by Crimsane (815761) <crimsonking@geekspot.org> on Wednesday November 09, @05:22PM (#13992934) (http://www.geekspot.org/) If I had to make a wager as to why he left, I would bet someone close to him got layed off and he put his own job on the line to defend them.I was sad to hear suse layed of This dude [beaufour.dk] who was doing lots of xforms stuff for FF.But of course Novell has been doing lots of good for a while now, all the time losing money, so I couldn't be too critcal. [ Reply to This Probably not a big deal (Score:5, Insightful) by Jherek Carnelian (831679) on Wednesday November 09, @05:22PM (#13992941) This departure is probably no big deal. Every single "amicable" corporation acquisition that I have ever seen worked out the same way. The founders of the acquired company stay on board in order to help assure a smooth merger. But after about a year or so, they almost always take off for new projects. I suspect that sticking around until now was a contractual obligation on his part as part of selling the company.These guys tend to be of two types - "startup" guys who don't think it is fun to run an established business, or a "control types" who aren't satisifed unless they are running the whole show. Either way, when they sell the company, they are no longer in the position that most appeals to them so they move on as soon as they can.So, I wouldn't take this event too seriously, he's probably had short-timer's disease for the last six months anyway. [ Reply to ThisRe:Probably not a big deal by segedunum (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:37PMRe:Probably not a big deal by T-Ranger (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:30PMRe:Probably not a big deal by superpulpsicle (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @08:13PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.1 reply beneath your current threshold. Yet another Novell failure (Score:3, Interesting) by stryemer (34743) on Wednesday November 09, @05:23PM (#13992956) Someone should put a stop to Novell. SuSE may be the next in a long line of great products (Corel, WordPerfect, etc) that Novell flushes down the toilet. It's really too bad because from my experience with SuSE was better than RedHat and Windows. Hey Novell management, fire yourselves! [ Reply to ThisRe:Yet another Novell failure by rm69990 (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @06:10PM Restructure... (Score:5, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 09, @05:24PM (#13992968) / Sorry, SuSE's restructuring supposed   \| that chamaleon got fired. Get used to  || me: the more efficient, featureful     |\ allmighty and POSIX compliant Clippy!  /        \     ____         \   / __ \          \  O|  |O|             ||  | |             ||  | |             ||    |              |___/ [ Reply to ThisRe:Restructure... by AndroidCat (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:44PMRe:Restructure... by keg (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:08PMRe:K5ARP, we love you by HishamMuhammad (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @09:11PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.2 replies beneath your current threshold. So why no KDE?? (Score:5, Interesting) by questro (802656) on Wednesday November 09, @05:26PM (#13992987) Is this guy leaving because KDE is being dropped? I really like SuSE and have been using it for a while. KDE is a big part of that. I like the polish. Is there some license issue that's driving the KDE issue? What gives? I hate to go switching distros AGAIN! This is why I stopped using RedHat/Fedora. [ Reply to ThisRe:So why no KDE?? by cloudmaster (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @05:31PMRe:So why no KDE?? by wik (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @08:03PM2 replies beneath your current threshold.Re:So why no KDE?? by rm69990 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:13PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:So why no KDE?? by billybob2 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @08:47PMRe:So why no KDE?? by houghi (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @09:08PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. Those Ximain Guys? (Score:2, Redundant) by Erore (8382) on Wednesday November 09, @05:26PM (#13992997) Rather interesting choice of words there at the end referring to the talent of the Ximian folks. Makes me wonder his resignation is tied to possible internal power struggles between KDE centric SUSE folks and GNOME centric Ximian developers. From last weeks announcement we know who won those battles, and it's possible his resignation is just part of the fallout. [ Reply to This1 reply beneath your current threshold. Not Unexpected. Next Stop Bankruptcy (Score:4, Interesting) by segedunum (883035) on Wednesday November 09, @05:32PM (#13993047) Well, some of us could have told him that as soon as Novell took over Suse. Novell has a terrible track record of making anything work. The warning signs were there when Richard Seibt and a few others left some time ago, as well as other Novell employees who didn't even come from Suse like Alan Nugent. And despite the positive spin [eweek.com] some people in the company have tried to make of this for their own ends, there's no denying that a lot of people from different parts of the company have been layed off. Yes, even a lot of Gnome oriented people have gone, which means that Novell has no resources and people whatsoever to carry out all of those desktop plans some people say they're doing. They're going to need to spend even more money just to tread water and maintain everything. Looks like there's some truth to Kurt Pfeifle's article, and Mantel's swipe that they should be able to find someone talented to replace him as a kernel developer from Ximian is telling. Novell may end up with no Gnome or KDE at all, or even worse, no Linux. People talk about KDE and Gnome a lot, but the fact is that Novell haven't even moved to Linux - that's where the real problems are. Open Enterprise Server is a bastardised Linux OS with Netware running on top of it. What customer wants that and what's the point?! No one judging from the people not buying it and going Red Hat instead. Unless this new COO really does understand his market, the technology and what's required we're seeing Novell go bust right here. Judging from this he's got the basic concepts of how to make people redundant badly wrong. Get that wrong, throw in the towel because it's not worth the effort. You need the right people on your side, not to alienate them. [ Reply to ThisRe:Not Unexpected. Next Stop Bankruptcy by deviator (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:52PMRe:Not Unexpected. Next Stop Bankruptcy by plieb (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @10:57PM The Conversations (Score:4, Funny) by mpapet (761907) <mpapet@@@yahoo...com> on Wednesday November 09, @05:33PM (#13993048) (http://www.michaelpapet.com/) The guy probably heard a few of these lines before throwing in the towel.1. Bring that point up at the next meeting.2. Check with person X to okay Y.3. Find out when person Z's subordinate has the time to do that task.4. I know you preferred Option A but the company is doing Option B.5. Fill out that form and give it to accounting and wait 30 days to get reimbursed.7. The Board has decided to go a diffferent direction.8. Let me run that by person A before doing anything.9. Send me an email about it to remind me....There's a bunch more probably much funnier too. Join in and add a few! [ Reply to ThisRe:The Conversations by segedunum (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:44PM Re:The Conversations (Score:4, Funny) by The Monster (227884) on Wednesday November 09, @05:51PM (#13993213) (http://slashdot.org/) 10. I think we need to establish a committee to deal with that.11. Is this initiative compatible with our Mission Statement?12. Can we proactively leverage vertical syergies to deliver five-nines reliability?13. We need a subcommittee to work on that aspect of your plan.14. Now that you've written all that code, we're changing the design specs on you.15. ...again.16. If there's such a thing as a sub-subcommittee, we'll be needing one of those.17. We need a cross-departmental task force to get a wider perspective on things.18. The task force needs to divide itself into committees along departmental lines.19. We need to make everything top priority!20. ???21. PROFIT! [ Reply to This | Parent fork it? (Score:2, Interesting) by towsonu2003 (928663) on Wednesday November 09, @05:37PM (#13993082) someone better fork (open)suse as soon as possible before it dies with novell... [ Reply to ThisRe:fork it? by rm69990 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:17PM Ximian division? (Score:3, Interesting) by LittleLebowskiUrbanA (619114) on Wednesday November 09, @05:41PM (#13993126) (http://slashdot.org/~LittleLebowskiUrbanA/journal/ | Last Journal: Saturday July 23, @03:42PM) After all, there are lots of extremely skilled people over there in the Ximian division    Is that a comment on mperhaps the Ximian guys being laid off too? Goddamnit, I like Suse and would hate to see Suse founder with all of the headway they've been making in the community. [ Reply to ThisRe:Ximian division? by Stumbles (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:41PMRe:Ximian division? by Jason Earl (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:33PM I have been on the fence, but this does it (Score:1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 09, @05:45PM (#13993157) I've never particularly liked the leadership and vision of RedHat. I guess RPM worked on some level and put them on the map, but I've hated it since I first started having to use it.So I've always been hoping for another group to step up. I thought I had found it with SuSE, where I experenced for the first time on Linux, something approaching a fully integrated GUI.However, this move signals that Ximian is going to start to get their hands all over SuSE and essentially ruin it. I hated the Ximian Desktop and those guys have absolutely NO SENSE WHATSOEVER about polish and quality. They royally suck. Then, add in stupid crap like MONO and that whole nonsense, and it's so easy to decide it's not even funny. GNU classpath is almost there, Eclipse already compiles and runs on Fedora core.You can get every level of fully community supported+bleeding edge, community supported on top of enterprise-ready (whitebox, centos, etc.), all the way to complete enterprise support.It's been a long, hard fought and well deserved win for RedHat in the area of Linux dominance through proper leadership instead of strong-armed tactics. I'm going all Fedora/RedHat on all my new systems. [ Reply to ThisRe:Avoid disappointment by rm69990 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:20PMRe:Avoid disappointment by LnxAddct (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:22PM2 replies beneath your current threshold. all I have to say is... (Score:3, Funny)

jonerik writes to tell us The Associated press is running an article stating that several American newspapers are going to start carrying manga with their normal arsenal of comics. The papers feel that this will help boost their readership amongst a younger audience. The two strips that made the cut are Van Von Hunter, and Peach Fuzz which are both created by American writer/illustrators and are being distributed by Universal Press Syndicate. American Newspapers to Begin Carrying Manga Log in/Create an Account | Top | 235 comments | Search Discussion Display Options Threshold: -1: 235 comments 0: 226 comments 1: 165 comments 2: 100 comments 3: 29 comments 4: 18 comments 5: 8 comments Flat Nested No Comments Threaded Oldest First Newest First Highest Scores First Oldest First (Ignore Threads) Newest First (Ignore Threads) The Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way. Not news (Score:5, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 09, @05:49PM (#13993185) Now, it if was hentai... [ Reply to ThisRe:Not news by Golias (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:59PMRe:Not news by vertinox (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:54PMRe:Not news by Basehart (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:28PMRe:Not news by Proz512 (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @08:59PMRe:Not news by Stephen Williams (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @07:06PMRe:Not news by Liam Slider (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @07:11PMRe:Not news by macshit (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:39PMRe:Not news by Liam Slider (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @10:55PMRe:Not news by Guuge (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @07:18PMLike it or not Manga now refers by geekoid (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:49PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:Not news by failedlogic (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:46PMThey DO make hentai! by cybermint (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @10:46PM How do we know this is manga? (Score:5, Interesting) by Ithika (703697) on Wednesday November 09, @05:49PM (#13993188) (http://www.livejournal.com/users/brokenhut/) Where does the line between manga and comic art exist then, if not by country of origin? [ Reply to This Re:How do we know this is manga? (Score:5, Funny) by Average_Joe_Sixpack (534373) on Wednesday November 09, @05:55PM (#13993234) The pane progression will be right to left [ Reply to This | ParentRe:How do we know this is manga? by TheLoneIguana (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:55PM Re:How do we know this is manga? (Score:5, Insightful) by Jeff DeMaagd (2015) on Wednesday November 09, @05:58PM (#13993266) (http://www.demaagd.com/ | Last Journal: Sunday October 27, @06:53PM) The problem is that the style of American "manga" is generally a stereotypical view of manga drawing styles. Sure, a lot of manga do follow the stereotype, alot don't. Besides, my understanding of the meaning of manga as a loan word in English always coincided with the origin, it doesn't make much sense to me to use a foreign loan word to describe a domestic product which there already exists a perfectly fine word - comic. [ Reply to This | ParentRe:How do we know this is manga? by Cygnus78 (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:44PMRe:How do we know this is manga? by Stalyn (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @07:51PM2 replies beneath your current threshold. Re:How do we know this is manga? (Score:5, Funny) by RobotRunAmok (595286) on Wednesday November 09, @05:56PM (#13993248) Where does the line between manga and comic art exist then, if not by country of origin?It's obviously more than just the big eyes. If that were the only qualification, we'd have seen Dragonball Orphan Annie Z! a long time ago. [ Reply to This | ParentRe:How do we know this is manga? by pcgabe (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:37PMRe:How do we know this is manga? by Rahga (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:20PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:How do we know this is manga? by Fallingcow (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @05:57PM Re:How do we know this is manga? (Score:4, Insightful) by Golias (176380) on Wednesday November 09, @06:03PM (#13993318) But what is the "Japanese style" of comics???The "big eyes" look that people seem to associate with Manga (even though it's not always used) is something that Osamu Tezuka stole from Disney's "Snow White."When I see must American attempts to make things "look Japanese" (such as the Teen Titan series currently on cable), it looks more like a parody of the oddest quirks of japanese anime than anything else. [ Reply to This | ParentRight here by Valiss (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:27PMRe:Right here by timeOday (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:54PMRe:How do we know this is manga? by Anonymous Coward (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @08:41PMRe:How do we know this is manga? by StikyPad (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @11:27PM3 replies beneath your current threshold.Re:How do we know this is manga? by Golias (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:21PMRe:How do we know this is manga? by SeventyBang (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:32PMRe:How do we know this is manga? by shinma (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:43PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. Re:How do we know this is manga? (Score:4, Insightful) by badasscat (563442) <basscadet75@yaho ... m minus language> on Wednesday November 09, @06:01PM (#13993292) (http://www.jwnyc.com/) Where does the line between manga and comic art exist then, if not by country of origin?I was thinking the same thing when I read that last sentence in the submission. "Manga" is not a style, it specifically refers to Japanese graphic storytelling. Otherwise there'd be no reason to even use that word. We use that word to refer to their comics/graphic novels because they use that word to refer to the same material. (It is the same with "anime".)Anything that is created outside of Japan is not manga, at least not if you're using that word to differentiate something from a standard comic (i.e. you are speaking English and not Japanese). It may be "manga-inspired", but it is not manga.People do get into arguments about this sort of thing, and yes, there can be questions of degree... a lot of anime, for example, is written and designed in Japan but drawn in Korea. Is it really anime? Probably. Same is true of some manga. But if you're talking about comics written by Americans, drawn by Americans, in America, that's just a comic. That's got nothing to do with manga, however its visual style may look. [ Reply to This | Parent Re:How do we know this is manga? (Score:5, Interesting) by Ungrounded Lightning (62228) on Wednesday November 09, @06:11PM (#13993386) (Last Journal: Sunday January 18, @06:45AM) Not to get into a "is" "isn't" flap...But I was under the impression that one large distinction was the set of graphic conventions used. (For instance: lightbulb-over-head versus laserbeam into head for idea, smoking head versus bulging veins for anger, etc.)I suspect when an american comic syndicate executive says "manga" he undersands it to mean a comic that uses the stylistic and graphic-linguistic convention set of manga, rather than whatever the "real" definition is. [ Reply to This | Parent Re:How do we know this is manga? (Score:4, Interesting) by Ithika (703697) on Wednesday November 09, @06:14PM (#13993416) (http://www.livejournal.com/users/brokenhut/) Despite the fact that this is the most sensible reasoning I've seen so far for using "manga" instead of "comic", it seems a bit daft to make a product full of cultural references and market it exclusively to people outside that culture. [ Reply to This | ParentRe:How do we know this is manga? by JanneM (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:31PMRe:How do we know this is manga? by Ithika (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:58PMRe:How do we know this is manga? by Helios1182 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:49PMRe:How do we know this is manga? by JanneM (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @08:56PMRe:How do we know this is manga? by rufty_tufty (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:55PMRe:How do we know this is manga? by vertinox (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:06PMRe:How do we know this is manga? by Ungrounded Lightning (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @10:35PMRe:How do we know this is manga? by Bingo Foo (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:39PMNot really by geekoid (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:47PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. Re:How do we know this is manga? (Score:4, Insightful) by MosesJones (55544) on Wednesday November 09, @07:14PM (#13993849) (http://service-architecture.blogspot.com/) And yet if Japan was to release films claiming to be "Hollywood Films", music that was "New Orleans Jazz" or selling "Texas BBQ Steak Mix" there would be little question of them cynically ripping off an American idea just to make a quick buck...Manga is Japanese, in the same was as Champagne is French, you can make it the same way, it might even taste the same... but no matter what you do its not the real thing.Pepsi ain't Coke folks... [ Reply to This | ParentRe:How do we know this is manga? by Martin Blank (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @08:14PMRe:How do we know this is manga? by weav (Score:1) Thursday November 10, @12:38AMRe:How do we know this is manga? by Guuge (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:51PMTell that to TOKYOPOP by RPGuy_AD (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @08:35PMManga = Comics by Jabrams007 (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @08:55PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:How do we know this is manga? by Dragoonmac (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:13PMRe:How do we know this is manga? by MightyMartian (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:30PMRe:How do we know this is manga? by Thunderstruck (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:59PMRe:How do we know this is manga? by burrows (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:31PMRe:How do we know this is manga? by michaelnz (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:44PMRe:How do we know this is manga? by luder (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:30PMRe:How do we know this is manga? by CastrTroy (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @09:58PM2 replies beneath your current threshold. pfffft .... (Score:4, Funny) by Average_Joe_Sixpack (534373) on Wednesday November 09, @05:50PM (#13993196) Manga has nothing on Ziggy [ Reply to ThisRe:pfffft .... by geomon (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @05:59PMRe:pfffft .... by commodoresloat (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:19PMRe:pfffft .... by suitepotato (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:22PMRe:pfffft .... by susano_otter (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @09:17PM Blasphemy (Score:5, Interesting) by cryptochrome (303529) on Wednesday November 09, @05:52PM (#13993218) (http://slashdot.org/~cryptochrome/journal/ | Last Journal: Friday April 08, @04:16PM) If it ain't Japanese it ain't manga. They should have picked up Azumanga Daioh [amazon.com]. [ Reply to ThisRe:Blasphemy by Wingie (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:08PMRe:Blasphemy by Guppy06 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:14PMRe:Blasphemy by Guppy06 (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @06:12PMRe:Blasphemy by BushCheney08 (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:30PMRe:Blasphemy by Mahou (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:34PMRe:Blasphemy by Guppy06 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:55PMRe:Blasphemy by Mahou (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:13PMRe:Blasphemy by Guppy06 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @08:23PMRe:Blasphemy by Random832 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @09:24PMRe:Blasphemy by Mahou (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @11:16PMRe:Blasphemy by Guppy06 (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @09:27PMRe:Blasphemy by Guppy06 (Score:2) Thursday November 10, @12:10AMRe:Blasphemy by Jeff DeMaagd (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:00PMRe:Blasphemy by Guppy06 (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @08:00PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:Blasphemy by Shelled (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @10:03PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:Blasphemy by darrylo (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:23PMRe:Blasphemy by zerofret (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @08:28PMRe: Uh... by Cryptnotic (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @09:40PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. How about accurate reporting? (Score:4, Insightful) by teutonic_leech (596265) on Wednesday November 09, @05:52PM (#13993220) Aaaah - manga to the rescue! If nothing else this shows how corrupt and clueless the American media landscape has become. After the obvious abandonment of objective reporting we experienced in the last three years, mixed with fabricated reports, a myopic coverage of world affairs, etc. it is manga that will get me to buy the paper now? Give me a break! If I want manga I either buy a printed copy dedicated to that genre, or buy a DVD, or if I'm really broke resort to eMule and co. I frankly wonder what PR company issued that one - must be the one that constantly claims that 'suits are back!' - LOL [ Reply to ThisRe:How about accurate reporting? by vermox (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:10PMRe:How about accurate reporting? by teutonic_leech (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:38PMRe:How about accurate reporting? by Sethus (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @11:29PM2 replies beneath your current threshold. about damn time (Score:2) by Brigadier (12956) on Wednesday November 09, @05:54PM (#13993233) commic strips haven't changed much in genre since I was a kid (i'm 30). With the exception of boon docks every comic is double digit years old. Only being retired when the artists have passed on. [ Reply to ThisRe:about damn time by Sabaki (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @05:59PMRe:about damn time by amliebsch (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @06:05PMRe:about damn time by Jules Mercuri (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:07PM To Boost Readership? (Score:2) by TheFlyingGoat (161967) on Wednesday November 09, @05:56PM (#13993243) (http://members.surfeu.fi/kklaine/primebear.html | Last Journal: Tuesday March 15, @01:16PM) Seriously, how many people subscribe to a newspaper for the cartoons. How many of those people would still subscribe if there were NO cartoons in the paper? Finally, how many people would subscribe or unsubscribe from a newspaper based on the availability of 2 comics. I would guess no more than 1 out of every 1000 for that last one, with 1 out of 10000 being more likely.While this is a cool thing, since I'll take a look at any new comic in the paper, I don't see it making any noticable impact on readership. Most papers would do better by coming up with a decent tech section and an Entertainment section with some interesting content. The Onion has a huge following just for their AV section, since they're well written and targeted at the teen-30 crowd. It's a good example to follow, newspapers. [ Reply to ThisA lot of people subscribe for the features by davidwr (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:05PMRe:To Boost Readership? by Golias (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:09PMRe:To Boost Readership? by InsideTheAsylum (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:13PMComics are important to newspapers by LunaticTippy (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:24PMRe:To Boost Readership? by LurkerXXX (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:34PMI disagree... by sp00n32 (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:35PMRe:To Boost Readership? by J-Rod_Brown (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:59PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:To Boost Readership? by oboreruhito (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:20PMRe:To Boost Readership? by phorm (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @09:23PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. Will it work? (Score:1) by icuc22too (928307) on Wednesday November 09, @05:58PM (#13993259) I wonder if adding manga would really encourage children to read the newspaper more. [ Reply to ThisRe:Will it work? by Spy der Mann (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @06:29PMRe:Will it work? by dillee1 (Score:1) Thursday November 10, @12:16AM Hmm (Score:5, Interesting) by pHatidic (163975) on Wednesday November 09, @05:59PM (#13993270) (http://www.alexkrupp.com/) How about filling their newspapers with informative and well written articles that don't contain glaring factual errors? It seems like almost every article on a subject I know something about has blatant factual errors in it.How about publishing the news as it happens? It seems like most of the articles in the New York Times cover things I knew about a week earlier.How about not using anonymous sources, or at the very least outing the sources if they are proved to have been lying?How about not pretending there is such a thing as unbiased reporting? Saying "one is lead to believe" instead of "I believe" is just another form of lying. [ Reply to ThisRe:Hmm by drewxhawaii (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:14PMRe:Hmm by InvalidError (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:36PMRe:Hmm by Ungrounded Lightning (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:23PMRe:Hmm by Anonymous Coward (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:46PMRe:Hmm by Ungrounded Lightning (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @10:46PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:Hmm by Kphrak (Score:3) Wednesday November 09, @06:43PMRe:Hmm by pHatidic (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:51PM2 replies beneath your current threshold. What's a "Newspaper"? (Score:2, Funny) by istartedi (132515) on Wednesday November 09, @06:00PM (#13993280) (Last Journal: Thursday April 18, @07:50PM) Where can I download it? 'nuff said. [ Reply to ThisYou need to check it out by geekoid (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:36PM Trendsetter (Score:4, Interesting) by czarangelus (805501) <iapetus@gmaiBALDWINl.com minus author> on Wednesday November 09, @06:00PM (#13993282) (http://chomped.org/) You know, this might be one of the smartest things anyone in the media has done recently. Even if it turns out to be an enormous flop (and I think it might have a chance of succeeding,) at least it's a new direction. They are at least trying to get out of their rut. [ Reply to ThisRe:Trendsetter by Mr. Slippery (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:14PM FR/BE (Score:1) by trollable (928694) on Wednesday November 09, @06:00PM (#13993284) (http://www.milliondollarscreenshot.com/) Guess they weren't ready for serious drawing (aka bande dessinee franco-belge but not only). I don't like too much mangas, at least those I read. But I probably didn't read the good ones. [ Reply to This What a shame. (Score:1) by jasongetsdown (890117) on Wednesday November 09, @06:06PM (#13993344) There are so many great comic artists who have been ignored for so long for the likes of Garfield (yawn) and Family Circus (shoot me). What a shame that they're going for the only genre that produces more cheap overdramatic and entirely unsubtle crap than Fox.There is some irony in the growing embrace of manga by americans though. The style was inspired by american cartoons after all. The only difference is that here we continue to treat comic art as kid stuff while in asia manga grew out of control like worms at chernoble. [ Reply to ThisRe:What a shame. by MS-06FZ (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @07:43PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. Nobody's said it yet... (Score:2) by Hosiah (849792) on Wednesday November 09, @06:07PM (#13993346) (http://wallpaperfree.blogspot.com/ | Last Journal: Sunday November 06, @11:32AM) Are they going to post instructions to read it right to left? [ Reply to This I've read Van Von Hunter... (Score:2) by Spy der Mann (805235) <spydermann.slashdot@NOspaM.gmail.com> on Wednesday November 09, @06:15PM (#13993424) (Last Journal: Wednesday October 12, @01:42PM) and I've become a fan of it. It has very good jokes, and tries to imitate the japanese narrative style (altho not completely, but that's not a defect). It reminds me a bit of the Slayers series, and also has (very funny) references to anime videogames.In comparison with american anime-like cartoons like Martin Mystery or Totally Spies (ack! Choke! Cough), VVH is much more anime-like, relatively speaking. And having seen garbage like digimon (eew) or DBZ (ugh), I say VVH has much more quality than them.So no, VVH is NOT a heresy against the concept of Manga / Anime.Regarding the inclusion of VVH in newspapers, I can say that it fits the format very well. It's done weekly, and altho it has a story, each strip doesn't need the reading of previous strips to get the joke. I personally recommend it to anyone. [ Reply to ThisRe:I've read Van Von Hunter... by IntergalacticWalrus (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @06:25PMRe:I've read Van Von Hunter... by Spy der Mann (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @06:32PMRe:I've read Van Von Hunter... by tahuti (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @08:46PMRe:I've read Van Von Hunter... by Spy der Mann (Score:1) Wednesday November 09, @09:51PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. Van von Hunter? (Score:2) by DarkSarin (651985) on Wednesday November 09, @06:15PM (#13993427) (http://www.bmo-web.com/ | Last Journal: Wednesday August 18, @08:37PM) Okay, seriously, that comic (call it what it is) is rarely, if ever, updated. Beyond that, it isn't the best of the online comics. I won't say what the best comic out there is (I read about 10 on a daily basis), because someone will certainly disagree with me--and I don't have my asbestos suit with me today.Instead, let me critique Van Von Hunter on what I know of the comic, having read all the past strips up to some point in the middle of this summer. The story is interesting enough, but rather, politely put, scattered in its approach. Frequent tangents and odd, rather sudden, inclusions from what started out to be a fairly cohesive storyline all combine for a feeling that the author doesn't care that much about the story or characters. Instead, it feels very much like a part time hobby that he does because he can. [ Reply to ThisRe:Van von Hunter? by Blakey Rat (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @07:57PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. Manga (Score:1) by spect3r (909619) on Wednesday November 09, @06:15PM (#13993431) (http://www.kevin-foster.net/) Is manga like Final Fantasy?No.. really? [ Reply to This Wtf? It will be americanized lame nothingness (Score:2, Interesting) by Werrismys (764601) on Wednesday November 09, @06:18PM (#13993460) Americans take what is brilliant, run it through a lamifying filter and end up with Fitz US style, Nikita US style. End result: lame, politically correct bullshit. [ Reply to ThisRe:Wtf? It will be americanized lame nothingness by RexRhino (Score:2) Wednesday November 09, @08:55PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. The new name of slashdot? (Score:1, Funny) by PopeOptimusPrime (875888) on Wednesday November 09, @06:25PM (#13993510) News for Losers. Stuff that noone cares about. [ Reply to This1 reply beneath your current threshold.