conq writes "A new survey shows that the tech industry places third after healthcare and energy companies in the number of lawsuits it deals with. It states that an average tech company faces 42 lawsuits currently, more than the insurance industry!" From the article: "An average U.S. technology company currently faces 42 lawsuits vs. 37 lawsuit for an average company. The tech industry places third, after healthcare and energy companies, in the number of lawsuits it deals with ... Needless to say, that's quite expensive. Nearly a third of these companies spend more than 2% of their gross revenue on legal expenses, according to one of the largest surveys of corporate counsel in America."Ads_xl=0;Ads_yl=0;Ads_xp='';Ads_yp='';Ads_xp1='';Ads_yp1='';Ads_par='';Ads_cnturl='';Ads_prf='page=article';Ads_channels='RON_P6_IMU';Ads_wrd='biz,tech,doj';Ads_kid=0;Ads_bid=0;Ads_sec=0; Tech Companies Swimming In Lawsuits Log in/Create an Account | Top | 96 comments | Search Discussion Display Options Threshold: -1: 96 comments 0: 93 comments 1: 79 comments 2: 54 comments 3: 19 comments 4: 12 comments 5: 7 comments Flat Nested No Comments Threaded Oldest First Newest First Highest Scores First Oldest First (Ignore Threads) Newest First (Ignore Threads) The Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way. Lies, damned, lies, and... (Score:5, Insightful) by seanadams.com (463190) * on Friday October 21, @07:24PM (#13849089) (http://www.seanadams.com/) Lies, damned, lies, and...The firm asked 354 companies in various industries about their top legal concerns.Which 354 did you ask? There are thousands of tech companies! Define "tech company". Or is this just the 354 you could think of who'd pick up the phone?That probably has something to do with tech companies having by far the greatest number of in-house attorneys managing litigation - an average of nine per company.Nine lawyers per tech company - w0w! That's amazing considering that the overwhelming majority of tech companies that I can think of don't even have nine employees. Do you have any idea how many startups there are in California alone? Do six PHDs in a small lab working on, say, the next medical laser breakthrough not count?Nearly a third of these companies spend more than 2% of their gross revenue on legal expensesWhich companies? What about the other two thirds? Are we supposed to think that 2% is a lot to spend on total legal expenses? What's the distribution?Olga, your numbers are a crock of shit, and they stinketh. If you're going to give us stats, try starting with something like "of the 100 highest-grossing telecom service companies". [ Reply to ThisRe:Lies, damned, lies, and... by Seumas (Score:2) Friday October 21, @07:34PMRe:Lies, damned, lies, and... by Krach42 (Score:3) Friday October 21, @07:36PM Re:Lies, damned, lies, and... (Score:4, Insightful) by CastrTroy (595695) on Friday October 21, @08:13PM (#13849449) (http://www.kibbee.ca/) Yeah, Average is a really bad number in this case. If microsoft has 17000 laywers, and 999 companies have 0 lawyers, then the average is 17 lawyers per company. on the other hand, only 0.1% of companies have any lawyers at all. A better number would be the median for the number of lawyers, or the number of lawyers per capita (other employees). [ Reply to This | ParentRe:Lies, damned, lies, and... by Krach42 (Score:2) Friday October 21, @10:03PM Re:Lies, damned, lies, and... (Score:4, Insightful) by d34thm0nk3y (653414) on Friday October 21, @07:46PM (#13849291) (http://www.guiltfreep2p.com/) I agree completely, but just because their statistics suck does not mean it is false. Intuitively it seems it would be true, but whatever... Anyway, my main point is a question. I understand why in traditional media you would not want to take the space for indepth analysis of the actual numbers (preferably alongside the numbers themselves). Why the hell though, on the web where extra information means adding a line under a word, do they refuse to ever show the actual numbers? Is it really just laziness? It seems like it would be so easy.... [ Reply to This | ParentRe:Lies, damned, lies, and... by CrazyDuke (Score:1) Friday October 21, @08:03PMRe:Lies, damned, lies, and... by 955301 (Score:2) Friday October 21, @08:08PMRe:Lies, damned, lies, and... by CrazyDuke (Score:2) Friday October 21, @08:43PMRe:Lies, damned, lies, and... by Zerathdune (Score:1) Friday October 21, @09:18PMRe:Lies, damned, lies, and... by Doc Ruby (Score:2) Friday October 21, @08:03PMRe:Lies, damned, lies, and... by saiphok (Score:1) Friday October 21, @08:03PMRe:Lies, damned, lies, and... by typical (Score:2) Friday October 21, @08:58PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:Lies, damned, lies, and... by CrazyDuke (Score:2) Friday October 21, @08:07PMRe:Lies, damned, lies, and... by Anonymous Coward (Score:1) Friday October 21, @08:22PM4 replies beneath your current threshold. Frivolous patents (Score:5, Interesting) by BWJones (18351) * on Friday October 21, @07:25PM (#13849094) (http://prometheus.med.utah.edu/~bwjones/ | Last Journal: Friday October 21, @01:11AM) It was explained to me this way when I was researching the cost of medicine in New Zealand versus the USA. "Look mate, we got rid of all the lawyers in the system and can actually afford to provide healthcare to every single one of our citizens as well as many visitors to our country". Perhaps that is a little simplistic, but there is an element of truth to that. I've written [utah.edu] before on the number of Ferraris, Lamborghinis, Bentlys and Maybachs! that I've seen in Sarasota, Florida. Apparently, a good number of the class action lawyers for the tobacco settlements live there and in fact, there was one law firm out on the key where I was staying that routinely had the most amazing high dollar automobiles out there. (Ever seen a Mclaren on the street?) That money comes from somewhere.The reasons for high number of suits in healthcare are somewhat different that that for tech companies lawsuits, which are more dependent upon a broken patent system which allows frivolous patents. [ Reply to ThisIt's called... by ackthpt (Score:1) Friday October 21, @07:40PMRe:It's called... by Anonymous Coward (Score:1) Friday October 21, @07:50PMRe:It's called... by ackthpt (Score:2) Friday October 21, @07:56PMRe:Frivolous patents by bani (Score:2) Friday October 21, @07:41PMRe:Frivolous patents by Kenshin (Score:2) Friday October 21, @08:08PMRe:Frivolous patents by astromog (Score:1) Friday October 21, @10:16PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:Frivolous patents by eonlabs (Score:1) Friday October 21, @08:39PMRe:Frivolous patents by thebdj (Score:2) Friday October 21, @11:03PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. Then there is Apple (Score:2) by catwh0re (540371) on Friday October 21, @07:27PM (#13849113) Where users will get together a class action lawsuit for their ipods being too scratchy. [ Reply to ThisRe:Then there is Apple by Trigun (Score:1) Friday October 21, @07:31PMRe:Then there is Apple by jcr (Score:2) Friday October 21, @07:41PMRe:Then there is Apple by pete6677 (Score:2) Friday October 21, @10:28PMRe:Then there is Apple by Doppler00 (Score:1) Friday October 21, @08:23PMRe:Then there is Apple by Zerathdune (Score:1) Friday October 21, @09:30PM When the average is 37 lawsuits... (Score:3, Insightful) by Trigun (685027) <evil.evilempire@ath@cx> on Friday October 21, @07:27PM (#13849114) (http://evilempire.ath.cx/) I think that there's a much larger problem then tech companies facing 42. [ Reply to ThisRe:When the average is 37 lawsuits... by Trigun (Score:2) Friday October 21, @07:33PM 42 is the answer. (Score:3, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 21, @07:27PM (#13849118) NOW! we know the question! [ Reply to ThisRe:42 is the answer. by Headcase88 (Score:1) Friday October 21, @08:23PMRe:42 is the answer. by kerohazel (Score:1) Friday October 21, @09:21PM Overdue Justice (Score:2, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 21, @07:30PM (#13849155) My favorite tech company lawsuit being the CEO of Savvis [thesmokinggun.com], from which I was laid off from. This news made my Friday. Jerk. [ Reply to ThisRe:Overdue Justice by ackthpt (Score:1) Friday October 21, @07:53PMRe:Overdue Justice by mikael (Score:2) Friday October 21, @07:59PMProbably extortion by temojen (Score:2) Friday October 21, @08:00PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. The ultimate question (Score:2, Funny) by ajdlinux (913987) on Friday October 21, @07:30PM (#13849158) How many lawsuits does a tech company face?Get free domains here [ezyrewards.com] [ Reply to ThisRe:The ultimate question by mordors9 (Score:2) Friday October 21, @07:40PM Clearly what we need here are... (Score:4, Funny) by Bin_jammin (684517) <Bin_jammin@spymac.com> on Friday October 21, @07:34PM (#13849203) more software patents. That will solve almost all legal woes with clear cut lines of IP ownership. [ Reply to ThisRe:Clearly what we need here are... by ScentCone (Score:2) Friday October 21, @07:54PMRe:Clearly what we need here are... by Bin_jammin (Score:1) Friday October 21, @09:05PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. With the energy company... (Score:1) by ackthpt (218170) * on Friday October 21, @07:35PM (#13849209) (http://www.dragonswest.com/ | Last Journal: Thursday February 24, @01:27PM) With the energy company, it's them you sue when you disconnected the gas stove youself, instead of calling them and your house blows up as a result. With tech companies, it's nothing new, Borroughs used to get sued all the time for misrepresenting their products. [ Reply to ThisRe:With the energy company... by KarmaMB84 (Score:2) Friday October 21, @09:05PMRe:With the energy company... by Reziac (Score:2) Friday October 21, @11:18PM Other Story (Score:3, Informative) by xanthines-R-yummy (635710) on Friday October 21, @07:35PM (#13849210) (Last Journal: Wednesday May 25, @12:39AM) Instead of a blog, how about a news story?http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9645594/ [msn.com] Yes, I do realize the source is from M$NBC... [ Reply to ThisRe:Other Story by xanthines-R-yummy (Score:2) Friday October 21, @07:40PM Did you hear about the little old lady? (Score:4, Funny) by Argonne (913222) * on Friday October 21, @07:39PM (#13849245) (Last Journal: Wednesday September 07, @07:29PM) She sued a tech firm after she spilled GTA "Hot Coffee" in her laptop. [ Reply to This It's a good time to be a lawyer (Score:1) by ClownsScareMe (840001) on Friday October 21, @07:41PM (#13849261) I'm dropping out of my Computer Engineering major and going to law school. [ Reply to ThisRe:It's a good time to be a lawyer by thebdj (Score:2) Friday October 21, @11:05PM This is easy fixed. (Score:1) by Freaky Spook (811861) on Friday October 21, @07:45PM (#13849286) We round up every laywer on the planet & stick them on an island with nothing but the clothes on their back & a hastily written & very outdated constitution. Then we film it.We not only do we get rid of our growing legal problem we also get a nifty reality TV we can watch with all our new found free time not spent in court or legal offices. [ Reply to This Question (Score:4, Funny) by Spy der Mann (805235) <(moc.liamg) (ta) (todhsals.nnamredyps)> on Friday October 21, @07:49PM (#13849316) (Last Journal: Wednesday October 12, @02:42PM) How many of these lawsuits involve "Intellectual Property" (copyright / RIAA subpoenas / patents),spamming or spyware?Just curious. [ Reply to ThisRe:Question by Zerathdune (Score:1) Friday October 21, @09:40PM average vs. mean (Score:5, Interesting) by 0WaitState (231806) on Friday October 21, @08:05PM (#13849408) Um, is this Microsoft plus 350 other companies averaging 42 lawsuits apiece? Kind of like the average net worth of the people in a bar going to one billion dollars when Bill Gates walks in? [ Reply to This It's just the beginning (Score:5, Interesting) by argoff (142580) on Friday October 21, @08:08PM (#13849424) The problem is that society is entering the information age, but society has two models of what kind of age that should be. In one model, all information must be controlled like "intellectual ptoperty" and leveraged for unlimited growth and profit. In the other, all information should flow without restrictions, and money should be made from collaberation, services, customisation, and general things that use information to create value.These are inherently and fundamentally incompatable. An anti-thesis to each other, and while you can't contoroll information with force - you can certainly attempt to bully, threaten, decieve, and sue - and this is exactly what is happening.So the suits that are happening now, I'm sure are just barely scratching the surface - as companies on the "intellectual property" side start to loose real money, and real market share, and loose out technology wise to the "freedom is free markets" side. You can be sure they will almost certainly freak, and "pull a SCO" across every industry and every sector.Also, as a note, a parrallel situation is also happening in the financial markets where industries and government are trying to controll and manipulate information on value and money for unlmited growth and profit too. This is about to explode as well.So watch out, and go offshore if you can, becasue all freakin hell is about to break loose. [ Reply to This2 replies beneath your current threshold. is 2% swimming (Score:3, Insightful) by fermion (181285) <lowt&bigfoot,com> on Friday October 21, @08:19PM (#13849482) (Last Journal: Saturday October 04, @11:52PM) I don't know if 2% of revenue is swimming. I think about 2% of my revenue. On a weekly basis, it is pocket money. It is enough that I would miss it, but still within a tolerable "cost of doing bidness".And what else might be done with 2%. An small increase in R&D. Perhaps retail prices would magically decrease 2%. Or drug abuse might marginally increase.If software companies at a number 3, I think this shows how the entire lawsuit thing has been overblow, and how most of the players are two faced. Even the republican party owes the ambulance chasers. It was they that got all the cig money for texas, which allowed Bush to balance the texas budget while cutting taxes, and helped him get elected to the big house. of course he thanked these lawyer by suing them for excessive billing, even though the billing had been agreed to, and they developed these cases with thier own money in the true spirit of entrepenurism, unlike other people we could mention.The other issue is how many of these are squabbled over IP, and how many are individual get rich quick schemes. I also have no sympathy for the drug companies. Roche is about to make a killing on Tamiflu, probably several billion in the next few years, much of it direct profit from licensing. Will they have to set some of it aside for lawsuit resulting from charges of gauging and the like. Probably. But if they would sell it to certain countries at cut rate, and deduct the good will, they might be able to save the lawyer fees. But they apparently have made the choice. [ Reply to This1 reply beneath your current threshold. Rules of Combat for the New Warriors Class (Score:5, Interesting) by Quirk (36086) on Friday October 21, @08:21PM (#13849490) (Last Journal: Monday October 03, @05:07PM) A few points in loose conjecture.My ex wife is a very successful barrister. She's a brilliant, talented woman. Through her I came to know the various subcultures of the legal world. One of the recurring analogies among the lawyers I've known is that they are hired guns. They are the new warrior class.During WWII a combat soldier, I can't recall his name or rank, noted that among his comrades only a few (~15%) actively engaged in combat and were responsible for most of the damage done to the enemy. Recently on the Discovery channel a U.S. Army Lt.Col. was shown trying to instill a 'killer instinct' in his troops. The show referred to the earlier WWII report that only a few combat soldiers did the actual wounding/killing. The Lt. Col. on the Discovery show said it was like having 85% of librarians illiterate.Following WWII tribes in New Gunea were introduced to rugby. The tribes took to wearing war gear to the rugby games and rugby substituted for tribal warfare.Remember the TOS episode where warfare had become virtual and those areas marked as 'hit' had to have it's citizenry report for euthanasia. In real combat losses are not that great in terms of the overall number of combatants. It may be because only a limited number of people are able and willing to kill or be killed. In a world overpopulated with 6 billion the amount of homicidal acts are not that great.Now with money substitutable for anything, the inclination to combat among individuals and corporate tribes, can be translated into litigation. The amount of litigation might be an index to our willingness to 'kill' oneanother, the more so when money substitutes for one's own blood.Lawyers are the new esquired warriors. What a horse and armour were to knights and warring lords, a law degree is to the corporate world.The question arises if, in an evolutionary context, the litiguous 'mortal/capital' combat effects a beneficial path.One of my favourite authors G. Bateson spoke to... "adversarial systems are notoriously subject to irrelevant determinism. The relative 'strength' of the adversaries is likely to rule the decision regardless of the relative strength of their arguments." [ Reply to This Re:Rules of Combat for the New Warriors Class (Score:5, Interesting) by cbdavis (114685) on Friday October 21, @09:30PM (#13849890) A quote from a Roman general, Heraclitis, over 2000 years ago, aboutwarfare and his troops:    "Of every 100 soldiers, 10 do not belong there and should be sent home. 80 are just targets. Nine are the true warriors, and we are glad to have them, for they make the battle. But one, he is the leader, and he brings the rest home." [ Reply to This | ParentRe:Rules of Combat for the New Warriors Class by superpulpsicle (Score:2) Friday October 21, @10:38PMRe:Rules of Combat for the New Warriors Class by Reziac (Score:2) Friday October 21, @11:11PMMOD PARENT UP OR I'LL SUE YOU by hublan (Score:1) Friday October 21, @09:55PMRe:Rules of Combat for the New Warriors Class by Omnifarious (Score:1) Friday October 21, @10:04PMRe:Rules of Combat for the New Warriors Class by blindbat (Score:1) Friday October 21, @10:14PMRe:Rules of Combat for the New Warriors Class by brit74 (Score:1) Friday October 21, @11:28PM It's about envy (Score:2) by wheelbarrow (811145) on Friday October 21, @08:24PM (#13849512) There are some folks out there who just can't stand to see others succeed where they fail. So, they find a reason to sue successful companies. Why work hard and take risks when you can just latch on and leach off those do take risks and work hard? [ Reply to This I wouldn't doubt it (Score:2, Informative) by cthulhuology (746986) on Friday October 21, @08:37PM (#13849590) Just on the personal level, I'm involved in a small startup venture. We have three people working here, 2 developers, 1 lawyer, and we also retain an outside counsel as well. We're not facing any lawsuits, and hopefully will never face one. When doing contract work, I'd say we spend more of our time dealing with the client's legal department than with the actual technical specification. Its utterly disgusting. [ Reply to This My experience (Score:5, Informative) by tjic (530860) on Friday October 21, @08:46PM (#13849635) (http://www.technicalvideorental.com/) I have no problem believing this.I run Technical Video Rental [technicalvideorental.com], and I've had - literally - dozens of legal threats over the simple fact that I buy DVDs, then rent them out. Despite the fact that this is deeply settled [wikipedia.org] case law, I've gotten everything from a legal cease-and-desist from one firm's CEO (who has a degree from Harvard Law School and was formerly Chief Counsel of the United States Senate Committee on Labor and Human Resources) to a threat to - ahem - anally rape me (from a guy who think's he's anonymous, because he doesn't know what website logs and IP addrs are).I spend about $2,000 - $3,000 per month on attorney fees trying to explain to people what the First Sale Doctrine is.This is money that could be spent growing the business, and delivering more interesting videos to my customers...but it gets squandered because so many folks (a) don't understand what the copyright law says; (b) don't understand that exposure increases sales (see also: MP3s and the RIAA).Bah.It'd be nice to spend more time doing business, instead of doing meta-business (lawsuits). [ Reply to ThisRe:My experience by ZachPruckowski (Score:2) Friday October 21, @10:03PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. 42! (Score:2, Funny) by MarcoPon (689115) on Friday October 21, @08:47PM (#13849647) (http://mark0.net/onlinetrid.aspx) Not 41, or 43.When a number say it all.Lawsuits are the final answer! [ Reply to This And they've been talking... (Score:1) by Jeian (409916) on Friday October 21, @08:56PM (#13849689) ... about holding software manufacturers liable for security problems. [ Reply to This In other news...... (Score:2, Funny) by rune2 (547599) on Friday October 21, @08:58PM (#13849705) (http://www.fragtopia.com/) This is one area where SCO is waaayy ahead of the average... pffft only 42 lawsuits... [ Reply to This U.S. only (of course) (Score:3, Interesting) by spookytoes (924762) on Friday October 21, @09:08PM (#13849760) Tripe. Compare with countries where court costs for frivolous litigation are routinely awarded to the defendant. Such awards are rare in the U.S., which I believe is one of the main reasons lawsuits are such a popular business model in the U.S. (plus, of course, the astronomical damages still being awarded).In most jurisdictions (e.g. Canada), it's fairly common that the defendant is awarded legal costs. The instigators of frivolous or exploratory civil suits have to reimburse those they attacked for lawyer and court costs, on top of any damages. [ Reply to ThisRe:U.S. only (of course) by Urusai (Score:2) Friday October 21, @09:50PM Only two jobs in the US in 2050 (Score:2) by gsfprez (27403) * on Friday October 21, @09:50PM (#13849989) (Last Journal: Tuesday September 23, @04:30PM) Lawyers and the lawyer's IT geek.i mean - there's not going to be anything else to do by that time. If you're not getting sued, the only way to make money will be to sue someone else. [ Reply to This Swimming in lawsuits? (Score:3, Funny) by mysidia (191772) on Friday October 21, @10:23PM (#13850125) (http://mysidia.darkfire.net/) More like sinking in lawsuits, maybe.When innovation is replaced with litigation, What other eventual outcome is to be expected? [ Reply to This thank you microsoft (Score:1) by suezz (804747) on Friday October 21, @11:16PM (#13850371) I purely put the blame on microsoft - they started this whole protecting your ip patent extortion scheme to fight linux.you never heard the word IP before microsoft started using it in their defense against linux.that is their only defense too - they can't write better software - so just sue them. [ Reply to This 'Lerached' (Score:2) by rlp (11898) on Saturday October 22, @12:48AM (#13850722) Back in the 90's the law firm of Bill Lerach - Milberg Weiss Bershad Hynes & Lerach sued so many (mostly tecb) companies that his name became a verb. Miss your quarterly earnings, miss a product deadline, and you could count on two things - a stock price drop, and a 'shareholder' class-action suit from Bill Lerach.Law suits against tech companies were so prevalent in the 90's, that Neal Stephenson made it part of a sub-plot in his brilliant novel 'Cryptonomicon'. [ Reply to This4 replies beneath your current threshold.