theodp writes to tell us that the National Academies, the nation's 'leading science advisory group', is warning of the continued loss of America's competitive edge with regards to science in the global community. In a press release they call for the immediate increase of teachers and advanced research and development, citing that 'in 2001 U.S. industry spent more on tort litigation than on research and development.' The Committee includes, among others, Intel's Craig 'Don't Call Us Benedict Arnold CEOs' Barrett. National Academies on U.S. Science Log in/Create an Account | Top | 285 comments | Search Discussion Display Options Threshold: -1: 285 comments 0: 282 comments 1: 217 comments 2: 166 comments 3: 47 comments 4: 22 comments 5: 11 comments Flat Nested No Comments Threaded Oldest First Newest First Highest Scores First Oldest First (Ignore Threads) Newest First (Ignore Threads) The Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way. never fear!! (Score:3, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday October 15, @07:34PM (#13799558) The Americans have "faith based" science. What could go wrong? [ Reply to This Re: never fear!! (Score:4, Funny) by Black Parrot (19622) on Saturday October 15, @07:40PM (#13799601) > The Americans have "faith based" science. What could go wrong?We may not produce the best science, but at least we produce the best musi- uh, the best televis- uh, the best automob- uh...We're screwed, aren't we. [ Reply to This | ParentRe: never fear!! by HungWeiLo (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @07:42PMRe: never fear!! by ilyaaohell (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @08:21PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re: never fear!! by Anonymous Coward (Score:3) Saturday October 15, @08:29PMRe: never fear!! by FLEB (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @09:09PM Re: never fear!! (Score:5, Funny) by at_slashdot (674436) on Saturday October 15, @09:09PM (#13800046) "We have zero inflation"Apparently we also have faith-based economy. [ Reply to This | ParentRe: never fear!! by WilliamSChips (Score:1) Saturday October 15, @07:43PMRe: never fear!! by NanoGator (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @10:03PMRe: never fear!! by Hatta (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @11:58PMRe: never fear!! by Trepalium (Score:1) Sunday October 16, @03:00AM2 replies beneath your current threshold.Re:never fear!! by mwaggs_jd (Score:1) Saturday October 15, @09:17PMRe:never fear!! by Robocoastie (Score:1) Saturday October 15, @10:51PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. Culture is the issue (Score:5, Insightful) by LaughingCoder (914424) on Saturday October 15, @07:38PM (#13799585) In American society, being good at math or science is generally regarded as geeky or nerdy and is roundly disparraged. Small wonder American kids want nothing to do with it. Look at the popular TV shows - many are about lawyers, doctors, and law enforcement types. If there is a technically saavy person, they are made fun of and treated as quaint. Until this changes we can throw all the money we want at the problem, but it won't change much. Back in the 60's it was cool to be into science - largely thanks to the space race (and to a lesser degree the cold war). There was even a TV personality (Fred MacMurray in My Three Sons) who played an aeronautical engineer, and he was actually portrayed in a positive light! That's impossible to imagine in today's culture. Maybe if we had something akin to the space program, say a race to energy indepenence, we could once again make it cool to pursue a career in science, math, physics or engineering. [ Reply to ThisTime for them to find a better culture. by CyricZ (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @07:42PMRe:Time for them to find a better culture. by Alejo (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @11:20PM Re:Culture is the issue (Score:4, Insightful) by going_the_2Rpi_way (818355) on Saturday October 15, @07:53PM (#13799675) (http://www.athenus.com/) I think the culture argument is mostly baloney, and the state of IP in the US contributes substantially.People 'do' science because they find it cool, not because they become rock stars. And there are of course science shows like "Numb3rs" (awful) and "CSI" and "Star Trek" and about a million others that try to some degree to spotlight science. The number of "Adventures in Engineering" or "Women in Engineering" camps has grown considerably over the last 10 years in these parts.Also changing is the degree of security around science (this has become a major issue to research and collaboration and being able to publish). The US has also historically had the incredible ability to draw the best minds from around the world. This is also changing as world opinion of the US drops and also as the security increases. Middle eastern researchers trying to work in the US face undue scrutiny from the authorities professionally and possibly prejdice in their family personally.Just my opinion of course... [ Reply to This | Parent Re:Culture is the issue (Score:5, Informative) by king-manic (409855) on Saturday October 15, @08:01PM (#13799714) (Last Journal: Friday May 28, @06:11PM) I think the culture argument is mostly baloney, and the state of IP in the US contributes substantially.People 'do' science because they find it cool, not because they become rock stars. And there are of course science shows like "Numb3rs" (awful) and "CSI" and "Star Trek" and about a million others that try to some degree to spotlight science. The number of "Adventures in Engineering" or "Women in Engineering" camps has grown considerably over the last 10 years in these parts. Actually, highschol culture is a huge reason why more people don't go into the sciences. That and the relatively low pay scales of scientists compared to other professions with similiar training periods. [ Reply to This | ParentRe:Culture is the issue by Eli Gottlieb (Score:1) Sunday October 16, @02:58AMRe:Culture is the issue by mikael (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @09:03PMRe:Culture is the issue by Courageous (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @11:38PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.The Playstation kiled the amateur radio by typical (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @02:55AMRe:Culture is the issue by LaughingCoder (Score:1) Sunday October 16, @09:13PMRe:Culture is the issue by going_the_2Rpi_way (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @09:46PMRe:Culture is the issue by RiotXIX (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @07:58PMRe:Culture is the issue by Sponge Bath (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @09:25PMRe:Culture is the issue by lazzaro (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @10:50PMRe:Culture is the issue by hubie (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @09:41PMRe:Culture is the issue by ZippyKitty (Score:3) Saturday October 15, @08:00PMIt's culture, but not the way people think. by mdarksbane (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @11:28PMRe:Culture is the issue by Gaurang (Score:1) Sunday October 16, @07:07AMRe:Culture is the issue by Raven_Stark (Score:1) Sunday October 16, @09:42AM Study hard, master your profession, get shit (Score:5, Informative) by Simonetta (207550) on Saturday October 15, @08:08PM (#13799735) I can't believe that the CEO of Intel is worried about the loss of US scientific positioning. He does everything possible to drive people OUT of the technical and engineering professions.    This is the guy who's company insists that you have college degrees and take a drug test before they will even consider you for a temp position working in any technicial position in his company.    Did I say temp? Goodness me, I meant perma-temp. Work for years as a 'contract' employee with no health insurance, job security, advancement, or benefits.    Intel sucks. Check out the FACEIntel website for more information. I spent a week at Intel ten years ago. I sure hope that I never have to go back there. Unless you are one of the top twenty people in the world at what you do, Intel is a total dead-end company. And if you are one of the top twenty people in the world in your speciality, why the hell would you want to work at Intel? It's a 'sixth sense' company; already dead but doesn't know it. [ Reply to This | ParentRe:Study hard, master your profession, get shit by Colonel Panic (Score:3) Saturday October 15, @08:45PM Re:Study hard, master your profession, get shit (Score:5, Interesting) by Courageous (228506) on Saturday October 15, @11:41PM (#13800672) There are good groups and there are bad groups. good managers and very bad managers.People who don't know big companies, don't realize that the truly large ones are more like many companies under one name. I work in one of America's top 10 defense companies; when the market changes around a bit, we actually shop for job (resume passing, interviews, and all) INSIDE the company. The differences in groups and even cultures is quite large.C// [ Reply to This | ParentRe:Study hard, master your profession, get shit by aero6dof (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @12:28AMRe:Study hard, master your profession, get shit by Courageous (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @01:01PMRe:Study hard, master your profession, get shit by s.fontinalis (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @01:02AMThe top 10%? Nope. by typical (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @03:08AMRe:The top 10%? Nope. by s.fontinalis (Score:2) Monday October 17, @12:19AMRe:Culture is the issue by pymike (Score:1) Saturday October 15, @08:13PMRe:Culture is the issue by Alex P Keaton in da (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @08:19PMRe:Culture is the issue by ilyaaohell (Score:3) Saturday October 15, @08:31PMRe:Culture is the issue by Alex P Keaton in da (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @08:44PMRe:Culture is the issue by ilyaaohell (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @08:53PMRe:Culture is the issue by Courageous (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @11:44PMRe:Culture is the issue by incom (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @12:05AMRe:Culture is the issue by Courageous (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @07:05PM2 replies beneath your current threshold. I would narrow this down (Score:4, Interesting) by Julian Morrison (5575) on Saturday October 15, @08:36PM (#13799857) It's not even your general culture. It's your public education system, which sucks every imaginable mode of ass. It is a union-captured mediocrity-ruled Prussian-designed system absolutely intended to hammer the individual flat to the collective.If you have a child in the USA, home-school them. Go hungry, rather than send them to government school. [ Reply to This | ParentUS is not the only one... by interactive_civilian (Score:3) Sunday October 16, @01:33AMA clarification... by interactive_civilian (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @02:08AMRe:US is not the only one... by drsquare (Score:1) Sunday October 16, @05:39AMRe:US is not the only one... by chialea (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @10:41AMSchool doesn't matter by typical (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @03:19AMRe:School doesn't matter by macshit (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @03:36PMRe:I would narrow this down by CountZero117 (Score:1) Sunday October 16, @04:15AMRe:I would narrow this down by Oligonicella (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @09:45AMRe:I would narrow this down by drsquare (Score:1) Sunday October 16, @05:34AMRe:I would narrow this down by Raven_Stark (Score:1) Sunday October 16, @10:21AM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:Culture is the issue by fbg111 (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @08:41PMRe:Culture is the issue by MrResistor (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @09:37PMWrong by ttfkam (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @11:33PMRe:Wrong by drsquare (Score:1) Sunday October 16, @05:43AMRe:Wrong by pnewhook (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @09:20AM Wrong. It is $$$ (Score:5, Insightful) by Ogemaniac (841129) on Saturday October 15, @10:04PM (#13800254) There was a recent wide-spread report indicating prestige of various professions, and scientists were number one! Lack of respect is not what is driving kids away from science, it is lack of cash. As I have posted here numerous times, a smart person can make a lot more money in law, business, or medicine, all without having to stay in school until one is 30 (or older, depending on the number of post-docs you have to grind through).Unless this changes, we aren't going to have lots of home-grown scientists. It is that simple.I am a chemistry post-doc at a highly-regarded university, and have every reason to consider myself a highly intelligent person. I work my ass off (60h/week...a REAL 60h). I am nearing my 31st birthday.I have never made more than $22,000 in a single year.Do you see the problem?And I won't even bother to elaborate on how slaving 60h+ each week in a virtually all-male environment inhibits one's social life. [ Reply to This | ParentRe:Wrong. It is $$$ by Courageous (Score:3) Saturday October 15, @11:50PMRe:Wrong. It is $$$ by Hsien (Score:1) Sunday October 16, @12:26AMThe lifetime earnings of a doctor are by Ogemaniac (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @10:37AMRe:Wrong. It is $$$ by Courageous (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @10:49AMRe:Wrong. It is $$$ by Courageous (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @01:04PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:Wrong. It is $$$ by Tablizer (Score:1) Sunday October 16, @12:17AMRe:Wrong. It is $$$ by Khalid (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @06:02AMHere in Japan by Ogemaniac (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @10:30AMRe:Wrong. It is $$$ by elakazal (Score:1) Sunday October 16, @12:06PM$140k vs $70k by Ogemaniac (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @10:44AMNow imagine you are a chemist by Ogemaniac (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @06:31PMTrust me, me and half of my colleagues by Ogemaniac (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @08:15PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.1 reply beneath your current threshold.3 replies beneath your current threshold. Re:Culture is the issue (Score:4, Insightful) by fireboy1919 (257783) <[gro.llehseerf] [ta] [pytsur]> on Saturday October 15, @10:28PM (#13800362) (http://rustyp.freeshell.org/ | Last Journal: Tuesday April 29, @10:22AM) Are you saying that shows about forensics and medicine aren't geeky? Have you watched any of those shows? They're all about the science!Ever watch MacGuyver? It had a pretty long run, and that wasn't too long ago. How about Jimmy Neutron? Main character, not comic relief, meant to be smart. Its still on.Its not impossible. Take off your nostalgia glasses and take a closer look. Its cooler to be a geek today than it has ever been. People wear the word with pride. Heck there are even companies that market the fact that they have them (Geek Squad, dial-a-geek).Its not the coolness we have to blame. People want to be smart more than they ever did. It's that1) Its hard2) We don't have enough people who are good at it to teach it.The same is true in other disciplines. Have you used AIM lately? Spelling, grammar, punctuation and vocabulary are pretty well shot. People don't have the ability to organize their thoughts into paragraphs (case in point: you). It seems as though we've come farther with those than with math.I don't think so. Its just that most of the other subjects are so much easier for so many people to understand. So they get a little farther with the same amount of effort. Therefore, they seem to be farther along.I have a hope that the coming of the age of the Internet is changing things. We have not had it very long, and I think that ultimately it is the internet that has changed the perception of geeks as cool. We will have to see how many teachers who are good at Math and science come out of it in the next two decades or so to see if it made a difference; its just too soon to tell.Of course, by then, we'll really know. Most of the teachers around today are about to retire. [ Reply to This | ParentThose that can, do. Those that can't, teach. by interactive_civilian (Score:3) Sunday October 16, @01:53AMRe:Those that can, do. Those that can't, teach. by LaughingCoder (Score:1) Sunday October 16, @02:42PMRe:Culture is the issue by rtb61 (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @02:51AMRe:Culture is the issue by xTantrum (Score:1) Sunday October 16, @07:33PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. Choosing between religion fanaticism and science. (Score:1, Interesting) by CyricZ (887944) on Saturday October 15, @07:38PM (#13799587) It's time for the US to choose between a reliance on religious fanaticism or science. If the focus remains on religious fanaticism, then the education of the nation's youth will suffer far more than it already had. But thankfully it's not too late to switch gears, and again put a focus on science and math (even if it means some contradiction with popular religious beliefs).Having recently travelled to several US states, I don't think that enough of the population would be willing to make such a necessary change. While there are many very intelligent and very astute Americans, they are unfortunately in the minority. The majority seem to be Bible-toting, science-hating individuals.Perhaps the best thing to do would be for America's scientific elite to leave America to those who are either religious fanatics or have a strong dislike for academia. There are always Western nations like England, Canada, Ireland, France, Germany, Belgium, Australia and many others who would gladly accept such talent. The scientists will be better off, and eventually those who rejected higher education will fall into economic obscurity. [ Reply to ThisRe:Choosing between religion fanaticism and scienc by Black Parrot (Score:1) Saturday October 15, @07:43PMRe:Choosing between religion fanaticism and scienc by Hao Wu (Score:3) Saturday October 15, @07:48PMRe:Choosing between religion fanaticism and scienc by typical (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @03:22AMRe:Choosing between religion fanaticism and scienc by tempehop (Score:1) Saturday October 15, @07:49PMRe:Choosing between religion fanaticism and scienc by Alex P Keaton in da (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @08:28PM Re:Choosing between religion fanaticism and scienc (Score:5, Insightful) by Kohath (38547) on Saturday October 15, @07:58PM (#13799695) It's time for the US to choose between a reliance on religious fanaticism or science.How would I recognize one of these fanatics? Would they- Obsessively post the same message over and over again?- Try to make every topic of discussion, no matter how unconnected, a forum for their views?- Consistently demonize other points of view?- Counter well-meaning factual arguments with name-calling?- Use guilt by association to try to discredit their unbelievers?- Use fear as a motivator?I sure am worried about all the fanaticism. I hope I can recognize it when I see it. [ Reply to This | ParentRe:Choosing between religion fanaticism and scienc by CyricZ (Score:1) Saturday October 15, @08:04PMRe:Choosing between religion fanaticism and scienc by Kohath (Score:3) Saturday October 15, @08:09PMThere are multiple problems, you do realize. by CyricZ (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @08:21PMRe:There are multiple problems, you do realize. by Kohath (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @08:29PMProfessionalism. by CyricZ (Score:1) Saturday October 15, @10:17PMRe:Professionalism. by CyricZ (Score:1) Sunday October 16, @11:03AM1 reply beneath your current threshold.1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:Choosing between religion fanaticism and scienc by NMerriam (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @08:23PMRe:Choosing between religion fanaticism and scienc by NMerriam (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @11:02PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:Choosing between religion fanaticism and scienc by Alex P Keaton in da (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @08:38PMRe:Choosing between religion fanaticism and scienc by mbrother (Score:3) Sunday October 16, @12:15AMRe:Choosing between religion fanaticism and scienc by Simon Garlick (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @08:13AMRe:Choosing between religion fanaticism and scienc by Just Another Poster (Score:1) Sunday October 16, @03:32AM1 reply beneath your current threshold. Re:Choosing between religion fanaticism and scienc (Score:4, Insightful) by king-manic (409855) on Saturday October 15, @08:58PM (#13799974) (Last Journal: Friday May 28, @06:11PM) - Obsessively post the same message over and over again?- Try to make every topic of discussion, no matter how unconnected, a forum for their views?- Consistently demonize other points of view?- Counter well-meaning factual arguments with name-calling?- Use guilt by association to try to discredit their unbelievers?- Use fear as a motivator?That sums up the bush administration and their supporters nicely. Good job. [ Reply to This | Parent1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:Choosing between religion fanaticism and scienc by ZippyKitty (Score:1) Saturday October 15, @08:16PMRe:Choosing between religion fanaticism and scienc by mbrother (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @12:20AMRe:Choosing between religion fanaticism and scienc by Erwos (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @08:34PMRe:Choosing between religion fanaticism and scienc by rco3 (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @09:32PMRe:Choosing between religion fanaticism and scienc by Sponge Bath (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @09:44PMRe:Choosing between religion fanaticism and scienc by zerus (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @08:34PMThey need to by CiXeL (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @09:10PMHow can you confuse a loud-mouth 1% with by Ogemaniac (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @10:46PM5 replies beneath your current threshold. The more things change... (Score:4, Insightful) by HanzoSpam (713251) on Saturday October 15, @07:39PM (#13799594) I remember hearing this business about our losing our scientific edge even as Apollo was landing astronauts on the moon. In itself, I really don't worry about it much. This has been a nation mostly of crackpots and bumpkins right from day one.Our advantage never came from having the brightest of populations, it came from having an economic and legal system that placed few barriers in the paths of the talented, which also made this country an attractive place for talented foreigners to migrate to as well (think Andy Grove, Albert Einstein or Andrew Carnegie).I'm a lot more worried about losing the advantages our legal and economic system afforded us than I am about some egalitarian vision of providing advanced education to the Great Unwashed. [ Reply to ThisRe:The more things change... by CyricZ (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @07:48PMRe:The more things change... by HanzoSpam (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @08:01PMRe:The more things change... by Rakishi (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @08:20PMRe:The more things change... by WilliamSChips (Score:1) Saturday October 15, @10:08PMRe:The more things change... by Rakishi (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @01:09AM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:The more things change... by Anonymous Coward (Score:1) Saturday October 15, @08:13PMNSF cuts? by Ogemaniac (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @10:55PMNote my key point by Ogemaniac (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @08:07PM2 replies beneath your current threshold.Yep. That Legal System Sure Doesn't Get in the Way by weston (Score:3) Saturday October 15, @08:36PMRe:Yep. That Legal System Sure Doesn't Get in the by HanzoSpam (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @08:46PMRe:The more things change... by king-manic (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @09:06PMRe:The more things change... by dbIII (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @09:40PMRe:The more things change... by typical (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @03:29AM2 replies beneath your current threshold. Dubya'd (Score:3, Insightful) by 0x15 (852429) on Saturday October 15, @07:41PM (#13799603) Let me get this staight, they're asking the guy who 'believes' that intelligent design should be given time in schools to improve our science curriculum?Obviously, this committee has a deathwish. [ Reply to This1 reply beneath your current threshold. I know who to blame (Score:3, Funny) by Kohath (38547) on Saturday October 15, @07:44PM (#13799626) But why is George Bush causing all these Slashdot dupes? [ Reply to This More investiments are always welcome (Score:5, Interesting) by gustgr (695173) <rondinaNO@SPAMgmail.com> on Saturday October 15, @07:44PM (#13799628) (http://gustgr.freeshell.org/ | Last Journal: Saturday January 08, @03:51AM) Last time I looked the US was the 1st on the list of scientific papers published by countries with more than 60% of the papers. The second position (United Kingdom IIRC) was really far from US in number of papers. It would be nice if not just one big expoend had the control of most scientific efforts, but many nations sharing this "privileged position".I indeed believe US industry should invest more in research (as all other nations should do, always, no matter what). But it's worthy noting that other nations are growing and maturing too, US can't avoid that. Besides that, this is not a fight. The benefits achieved from researches aims all humanity (at least it should be that way), so it isn't important who is at the top of the list, but it is important to support studies and researches, both in academia and in industry. [ Reply to This Re:More investiments are always welcome (Score:4, Informative) by Alomex (148003) on Saturday October 15, @07:55PM (#13799684) (http://slashdot.org/) Last time I looked the US was the 1st on the list of scientific papers published by countries with more than 60% of the papers.Then you haven't looked recently. The US is now below 50% of publications in many areas. [ Reply to This | ParentRe:More investiments are always welcome by drooling-dog (Score:3) Saturday October 15, @08:30PMRe:More investiments are always welcome by Frogbert (Score:2) Saturday October 15, @08:56PM 33%, not 60% (Score:5, Informative) by Dire Bonobo (812883) on Sunday October 16, @12:20AM (#13800808) > Last time I looked the US was the 1st on the list of scientific> papers published by countries with more than 60% of the papers.Then you must not have looked since about 1960. As of 2005, the US published only 33% of world science papers, significantly less than the EU (38%) and only half again more than Asia-Pacific (25%). source [physorg.com], more detail [thomson.com]What's interesting to note is that the EU's share of world publications has increased by almost 20% in the last 20 years (from 32%) and Asia's by almost 100%, but the USA's has fallen by almost 20% (from 40% to 33%).In other words, the US has been losing its tech edge for at least the last 20 years. [ Reply to This | ParentRe:33%, not 60% by ponos (Score:2) Monday October 17, @04:49AMRe:33%, not 60% by solarlux (Score:2) Monday October 17, @10:02AMRe:33%, not 60% by Dire Bonobo (Score:2) Monday October 17, @01:37PMRTFP by Dire Bonobo (Score:2) Monday October 17, @01:38AMDevelopment, not politics by Dire Bonobo (Score:2) Monday October 17, @01:42AM2 replies beneath your current threshold.1 reply beneath your current threshold. Shouldn't make generalizations (Score:2) by MarkWatson (189759) on Saturday October 15, @07:46PM (#13799639) (http://www.markwatson.com/) While there are disturbing trends (e.g., low math and science scores, more interest in education in developing nations, eventual decline of U.S. economy) I think that there is still a lot to be optimistic about.For one thing, the standard of living is so high in the U.S., that a decline of luxuries is liveable -really what do you need but good friends, family food, and shelter - give me a break on the Polyana B.S. because I just got back from a good friend's wedding (where I was asked to play my didgeridoo :-). Really, it is relationships that matter in life, not material crap.I still believe that the U.S. (along with a lot of other countries) still has a surfeit of talented creative people. Right now, innovative web applications is what is catching my interests - but there is a lot of great things happening in field of IT.Sure the trends are a little disturbing, but people who love doing what they do will mostly still have good lives, even if things in the U.S. generally decline. [ Reply to This1 reply beneath your current threshold. Mixed Message on U.S. Science Careers? (Score:2) by theodp (442580) on Saturday October 15, @07:47PM (#13799644) From the press release: "For the cost of one chemist or one engineer in the United States, a company can hire about five chemists in China or 11 engineers in India." [ Reply to ThisRe:Mixed Message on U.S. Science Careers? by ishmaelflood (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @01:40AMRe:Mixed Message on U.S. Science Careers? by typical (Score:2) Sunday October 16, @03:32AM1 reply beneath your current threshold. I'm not suprised! (Score:2) by bogaboga (793279) on Saturday October 15, @07:51PM (#13799669) I am a mathematics teacher and in my class, only foreign born students see the value of education and put efforts at learning. Even those from impoverished economies in Africa do better when compared to my American students. Meanwhile, in another class at my school, our American [educational] system is producing pretty confident students, but who cannot deliver in the real world. As me what they are confident at: Gameboys, iPODs and PS2s. Sad indeed.We have a theory though: At our school, we think that American students are growing up with too many distractions and marketing to kids by companies wishing to expand profits is not helping our efforts at all. The other thing is hip-hop. You have these fellows bragging about how they dropped out of school, but now own limos. Then you have the "race to the bottom" with low paying jobs (read Wal-Mart), to the extent that to be in the middle class now, as a family, there MUST be at least 2 income earners. Studies show that it was not like that in the fifties. [ Reply to ThisRe:I'm not suprised! by Anonymous Coward (Score:1) Saturday October 15, @10:42PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. Fix the fucked up patent system? (Score:2) by brxndxn (461473) on Saturday October 15, @07:51PM (#13799671) Or is extended litigation actually benefecial for our economy? I mean.. Money goes into research for goods and services.. Or, corporate money (money indirectly and directly from workers and investers) can go into the hands of rich law firms (to the tune of 30% each transaction)..So.. is it beneficial for our economy to increase the gap between the rich and the middle class? [ Reply to This