tabdelgawad writes "The New York Times reports that the FCC is requiring universities to upgrade their online systems to comply with the 1994 wiretap law, which would make it easier for law enforcement to monitor communications online. The universities are not objecting on civil rights grounds (the law requires a court order before monitoring), but on cost grounds (upgrades may cost $7 billion). But with the technology infrastructure in place, what happens if congress decides to relax court order requirements in the future 'in their fight against criminals, terrorists and spies?'"Ads_xl=0;Ads_yl=0;Ads_xp='';Ads_yp='';Ads_xp1='';Ads_yp1='';Ads_par='';Ads_cnturl='';Ads_prf='page=article';Ads_channels='RON_P6_IMU';Ads_wrd='privacy,tech,politics';Ads_kid=0;Ads_bid=0;Ads_sec=0; FCC Demands Universities Comply With Wiretap Law Log in/Create an Account | Top | 144 comments | Search Discussion Display Options Threshold: -1: 144 comments 0: 142 comments 1: 107 comments 2: 70 comments 3: 22 comments 4: 8 comments 5: 5 comments Flat Nested No Comments Threaded Oldest First Newest First Highest Scores First Oldest First (Ignore Threads) Newest First (Ignore Threads) The Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way. Nice (Score:2, Interesting) by Jonnty (910561) <jonnty AT gmail DOT com> on Saturday October 22, @05:45PM (#13854117) So they have to pay lots of money and reduce their civil rights completly (I don't think any privacy laws are legally binding anymore...)It's got to stop. Unless the court order remains and is completly open, which isn't going to happen, this is just not acceptable.At least I live in Britain, which hasn't got all these civil rights reducing measures...quite yet. [ Reply to ThisRe:Nice by Pantero Blanco (Score:3) Saturday October 22, @06:13PMRe:Nice by dfjunior (Score:1) Saturday October 22, @07:41PMRe:Nice by markh1967 (Score:3) Saturday October 22, @08:59PMRe:Nice by MyNameIsFred (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @07:54PMRe:Nice by mOdQuArK! (Score:1) Sunday October 23, @12:33AMRe:Nice by Pantero Blanco (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @07:57PMRe:Nice by Jonnty (Score:1) Saturday October 22, @08:21PMRe:Nice by timmyf2371 (Score:3) Saturday October 22, @08:41PMNot Really by Agarax (Score:1) Saturday October 22, @08:39PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. Re:Nice (Score:5, Informative) by timmyf2371 (586051) <[moc.liaMG] [ta] [1732fymmit]> on Saturday October 22, @06:24PM (#13854267) (http://www.timfarrell.co.uk/) Sorry to break it to you, but you might want to read up on the Regulatory of Investgatory Powers Bill [the-statio...fice.co.uk].In summary, the Government can "request" your password/encryption key at any time. Failure to hand it over, or even to disclose to anyone that you have been "asked" is a criminal offence punishable by jailtime. Oh, and a bunch of other goodies which totally make a mockery of our justice system and civil rights. [ Reply to This | ParentRe:Nice by tftp (Score:1) Saturday October 22, @07:45PMRe:Nice by timmyf2371 (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @08:32PMRe:Nice by Ash-Fox (Score:1) Saturday October 22, @08:45PMYep. A more interesting article would be... by msauve (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @09:11PM real criminals use prepaid.. not land lines... (Score:5, Insightful) by User 956 (568564) on Saturday October 22, @07:09PM (#13854463) (http://strk3.com/bush/) In 2004, court-ordered wiretaps increased by 19% [sfgate.com]. This number doesn't even include terror-related wiretaps (which number an unheard of 1,754). It also doesn't include so-called "secret" wiretaps, allowed by Patriot.The only groups these wiretaps hurt are the law-abiding citizens. The smart (read: dangerous) criminals have it all figured out-- Prepaid cell phones.Pre-paid cell phones are literally disposable, one-use toys to the bad guys. You don't even need a fake ID, just cash, and not all that much at that. How can they tap your phone when you use a different phone for each call? The best they could do is tap all the pre-paid phones and listen to every conversation out there -- good luck with that! (wanna bet the NSA is big into voice recognition?) [ Reply to This | ParentGotta watch The Wire by Jordan Catalano (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @07:30PMRe:real criminals use prepaid.. not land lines... by janoc (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @09:24PMRe:real criminals use prepaid.. not land lines... by glittermage (Score:1) Saturday October 22, @11:46PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Only one way to stop it by nurb432 (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @09:09PMRe:Only one way to stop it by NewKimAll (Score:1) Saturday October 22, @11:41PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. Read carefully... (Score:5, Funny) by Propagandhi (570791) on Saturday October 22, @05:46PM (#13854121) (Last Journal: Sunday November 07, @12:48AM) When I first read that headline I thought it said FCC Demands Universe Comply With Wiretap Law... Oddly, it didn't seem at all surprising. [ Reply to ThisRe:Read carefully... by Meagermanx (Score:1) Saturday October 22, @05:59PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. Some thoughts (Score:1) by ZippyKitty (902321) on Saturday October 22, @05:49PM (#13854127) Can't read TFA - you need to log in. I'm not sure objecting to possible future law changes is valid. While the government has been known to make those proposed law changes, they still actually have to change the law. The problem with some laws, and the ones we usually complain about here, is that they don't need to be changed to be abusive. Court supervision is our society's check on the power of investigating bodies. According to the summary - the law qualifies. [ Reply to ThisRe:Some thoughts - Article Text by Anonymous Coward (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @05:53PMWho can "tap" a line? by khasim (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @05:55PMRe:Who can "tap" a line? by The Warlock (Score:1) Saturday October 22, @07:08PM Got to love /. (Score:2, Insightful) by shawn(at)fsu (447153) on Saturday October 22, @05:51PM (#13854133) (http://www.digitaldistortion.org/ | Last Journal: Friday December 12, @06:52PM) But with the technology infrastructure in place, what happens if congress decides to relax court order requirements in the future 'in their fight against criminals, terrorists and spies?'Every time a stroy likes this gets posted we don't complain about the facts we get cought up in "what if's" [ Reply to ThisRe:Got to love /. by Daleks (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @06:01PMRe:Got to love /. by mboverload (Score:1) Saturday October 22, @06:46PMRe:Got to love /. by hazem (Score:3) Saturday October 22, @06:51PMRe:Got to love /. by Infosquawk (Score:1) Saturday October 22, @10:02PMFourth Amendment by sconeu (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @10:59PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. University expenses (Score:2) by MarkRose (820682) on Saturday October 22, @05:52PM (#13854135) (http://markrose.ca/) Seven billion dollars?! What a universal pain in the ass! [ Reply to ThisRe:University expenses by Artevelde (Score:1) Saturday October 22, @06:30PMRe:University expenses by residieu (Score:1) Saturday October 22, @07:11PMRe:University expenses by Impeesa (Score:1) Saturday October 22, @06:31PM Only criminals, terrorists and spies? (Score:4, Funny) by Wesley Felter (138342) <wesley@felter.org> on Saturday October 22, @05:52PM (#13854137) (http://felter.org/wesley/) Where's the fourth horseman? There are supposed to be four! [ Reply to This Re:Only criminals, terrorists and spies? (Score:4, Funny) by FidelCatsro (861135) <fidelcatsro@[ ]il.com ['gma' in gap]> on Saturday October 22, @06:08PM (#13854202) (Last Journal: Saturday October 22, @05:55PM) Lawyers [ Reply to This | ParentRe:Only criminals, terrorists and spies? by SpaceLifeForm (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @06:08PMRe:Only criminals, terrorists and spies? by Anonymous Coward (Score:1) Saturday October 22, @06:39PMRe:Only criminals, terrorists and spies? by dasunt (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @07:25PMRe:Only criminals, terrorists and spies? by Dwonis (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @11:43PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. There is something fundamentally wrong here (Score:5, Insightful) by cgenman (325138) on Saturday October 22, @05:52PM (#13854138) (http://www.chriscanfield.net/) The federal government wants to make it more difficult for "criminals, terrorists and spies" by opening more backdoors in the system? Isn't that exactly the sort of thing that would make it easier for criminals, terrorists, and spies to get the info they need? [ Reply to ThisDamn you informed citizen! by ravenspear (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @05:56PMRe:There is something fundamentally wrong here by 42Penguins (Score:1) Saturday October 22, @06:12PMRe:There is something fundamentally wrong here by Seumas (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @06:13PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. LOGIN FOR TFA (Score:3, Informative) by Lurk3r (786010) on Saturday October 22, @05:53PM (#13854139) A login for TFA isLogin: slashdot@slashdot.orgPassword: slashdot [ Reply to ThisRe:LOGIN FOR TFA by Fermatprime (Score:1) Saturday October 22, @06:31PMRe:LOGIN FOR TFA by Anonymous Coward (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @06:34PM Ex parte, friends. (Score:5, Insightful) by fuzzy12345 (745891) on Saturday October 22, @05:57PM (#13854159) One thing you have to understand: Our legal system is normally an adversarial one. It isn't the judge's role to question one side's assertion, that's the other side's job. The judge is typically a neutral arbiter who doesn't ask hard questions, but relies on the self-interest of two warring parties to expose each other's weaknesses.Wiretap orders are ex-parte. That is, only one party is present, and the judge, normally neutral, is expected to suddenly become a more active participant in the search for justice (like judges in civil/Napoleonic code type jurisdictions are), asking hard questions in place of the absent other party. Needless to say, a judge who normally acts in one paradigm (and indeed has no training in the other) isn't likely to suddenly change his stripes. Further, the police know full well which judges are likely to ask a question or two and which are likely to issue an order without question, so judge shopping inevitably occurs.What percentage of search warrants and wiretap requests are denied? I challenge you to even find statistics about such things.Parte on, dudes. [ Reply to ThisRe:Ex parte, friends. by belmolis (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @06:08PM1 reply beneath your current threshold.Re:Ex parte, friends. by the eric conspiracy (Score:3) Saturday October 22, @06:21PMRe:Ex parte, friends. by njyoder (Score:1) Saturday October 22, @08:27PMRe:Ex parte, friends. by the eric conspiracy (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @08:42PMRe:Ex parte, friends. by njyoder (Score:1) Saturday October 22, @09:00PMRe:Ex parte, friends. by the eric conspiracy (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @10:39PMRe:Ex parte, friends. by njyoder (Score:1) Saturday October 22, @10:48PMRe:Ex parte, friends. by michael_cain (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @09:31PMRe:Ex parte, friends. by Dwonis (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @11:38PMRe:Ex parte, friends. by A Guy From Ottawa (Score:1) Saturday October 22, @07:06PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. Secure SSH Tunneling (Score:3, Insightful) by AppleFever (917782) on Saturday October 22, @05:59PM (#13854166) I already know that my university network isn't secure from fellow students, so basically what this does is allow law enforcement to sit on their asses from work and see what us kiddos are doing...when all they needed to do was walk their laptop over here and plug into the wall and they can do the same.The solution is simple, and I do it myself. I SSH Tunnel all of my traffic out of my university to my off-site server so that I don't have to worry about an insecure network. I don't have any control over their policies and sniffing is very simple, even on a switched network.When your ISP (the university) doesn't have your security in mind, then why should I trust them? And I have even more reason to now.And I am not forgetting that the off-site server will soon have a similar back door made by my ISP. And when that happens, I might as well look for a server in NL._ _ _ _ _ _Got Teeth?http://www.doctorgallagher.com/ [doctorgallagher.com] [ Reply to ThisRe:Secure SSH Tunneling by gullevek (Score:3) Saturday October 22, @07:37PM2 replies beneath your current threshold. "What happens if congress relaxes requirements?" (Score:3, Insightful) by Pyromage (19360) on Saturday October 22, @05:59PM (#13854167) (http://slashdot.org/) I'm on your side in this one, but honestly, how could you possibly think that "Well, they might decide to fuck us later" is a valid argument?If it were, you wouldn't be allowed to do anything. Well, if I pay you for my groceries, you might just take the money and run, so I don't have to pay. But officer, if you arrest me, you might beat a confession out of me, so you're not allowed to arrest me.No, congress isn't supposed to be allowed to fuck me over things I 'might' do, and the inverse applies too. [ Reply to ThisRe:"What happens if congress relaxes requirements? by tabdelgawad (Score:3) Saturday October 22, @06:16PMRe:"What happens if congress relaxes requirements? by Oligonicella (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @08:50PMRe:"What happens if congress relaxes requirements? by markdavis (Score:1) Saturday October 22, @06:30PMRe:"What happens if congress relaxes requirements? by ScrewMaster (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @06:45PMSeatbelts by sconeu (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @10:56PM2 replies beneath your current threshold. IN SOVIET RUSSIA (Score:2) by $RANDOMLUSER (804576) on Saturday October 22, @06:09PM (#13854205) FCC taps YOU!errrr.... never mind... [ Reply to This1 reply beneath your current threshold. The real question here (Score:2, Interesting) by asadodetira (664509) on Saturday October 22, @06:09PM (#13854207) (http://ingqca.blogspot.com/) As technology facilitates eavesdropping and spying on each other, one may well assume that the only reasonable thing to do is to adopt a position of total openness of information for all, with nobody having any secrets to hide.The real question here is...If we were all wiretapped. How many of us would have things to hide? [ Reply to ThisRe:The real question here by tftp (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @06:27PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. heres an idea (Score:2, Funny) by fender_rock (824741) on Saturday October 22, @06:10PM (#13854210) (http://www.colinodell.com/) Perhaps the US government in their infinite wisdom could devise some plan whereas they go about renetworking the entire internet through the FBI? After all, the US does own the world. Don't we? [ Reply to ThisRe:heres an idea by fender_rock (Score:1) Saturday October 22, @06:19PM In A Dictatorship, The Dissident Is A Criminal (Score:3, Insightful) by tbuckner (861471) on Saturday October 22, @06:10PM (#13854212) Let's face it, an inefficient law-enforcement apparatus is the only reason we still have certain freedoms at all. The closer the government can get to truly universal surveillance (total tapping capability, cameras everywhere, biometrics and data-mining methods to handle the firehose of data), the closer we come to a police state that cannot be resisted. That's why the feds are leaning on Skype and other VOIP providers; currently, Skype can't be tapped. The most dangerous weapon a criminal can carry is a badge. [ Reply to ThisRe:In A Dictatorship, The Dissident Is A Criminal by Ash-Fox (Score:1) Saturday October 22, @08:32PMRe:In A Dictatorship, The Dissident Is A Criminal by glittermage (Score:1) Saturday October 22, @11:55PM2 replies beneath your current threshold. Ban Infrastructure? (Score:2) by fm6 (162816) on Saturday October 22, @06:15PM (#13854225) (http://picknit.com/ | Last Journal: Tuesday August 09, @03:53PM) But with the technology infrastructure in place, what happens if congress decides to relax court order requirements in the future 'in their fight against criminals, terrorists and spies? Civil Libertarians worry too much about infrastructure. Not that the treat to privacy isn't real. But not having an evesdropping infrastructure in place doesn't buy us much. Consider the phone system. Not so long ago, you tapping a phone was hard. You had to make a physical connection to the specific phone line. ("Hey Bugsy! What's that clicking sound!?") But it was a lot harder for a pre-Patriot Act FBI agent to get permission to push that button than it was for his 1960s counterpart to get permission to plant a tape recorder in your basement.The real threat to civil liberties is not the enabling technology. It's legal and political policies that authorize such threats. [ Reply to This1 reply beneath your current threshold. here's another idea (Score:1) by fender_rock (824741) on Saturday October 22, @06:16PM (#13854229) (http://www.colinodell.com/) the FCC is requiring universities to upgrade their online systemsWhy doesnt the FCC downgrade their online systems? That way everybody will be nice and compatible again, and I can continue my download of The 40 Year Old Virgin torrent. Maybe a little pr0n too while I'm at it... [ Reply to This My own insane theory (Score:3, Interesting) by pcgamez (40751) on Saturday October 22, @06:19PM (#13854246) (http://www.iblist.com/) Why doesn't the FCC pay for it? I bet that will get them to have some common sense. I of course realise this means that the cost will still be the same or more. What it will also do is raise more congressional concern as the FCC will have to request that amount. [ Reply to ThisRe:My own insane theory by Jester998 (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @08:03PMRe:My own insane theory by pcgamez (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @08:09PM1 reply beneath your current threshold. I want my CS classes or screw the Feds! (Score:2) by creimer (824291) on Saturday October 22, @06:22PM (#13854262) (http://www.creimer.ws/ | Last Journal: Monday August 01, @12:45AM) I waited three years for the C++ classes to become available at the local community college since the school didn't have the money to renew the Microsoft site license. (Java and Linux was taught during the meantime; not bad but job market for C++ programmers is a tad bit larger.) Now the Feds want the schools to upgrade the network infrastructure to find the next Neo in the Matrix. Oh, my gosh. I wonder which budget that little hardware upgrade is going to come from. Guess I'll be learning more Java at Starbucks when I graduate. [ Reply to ThisRe:I want my CS classes or screw the Feds! by MacJedi (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @07:54PM About time! (Score:2) by griffjon (14945) <GriffJon@noSpAm.Hotmail.com> on Saturday October 22, @06:30PM (#13854292) (http://www.griffjon.com/ | Last Journal: Wednesday September 26, @07:14PM) Universities are well known for harboring dissidents and terrorists [kent.edu].It's all that edumakashun. We should get rid of that, too. [ Reply to This Universities are the best place to look! (Score:3, Interesting) by mc6809e (214243) on Saturday October 22, @06:30PM (#13854293) University Professor Endorses Jihad [humaneventsonline.com] Jihad at San Francisco State [frontpagemag.com] CU prof's essay sparks dispute - Prof Ward Churchill says 9/11 victims were not innocent people [freerepublic.com]USF Professor Sami Al-Arian calls for "Death of Israel" and "Damn America" [sptimes.com] University of New Mexico Professor Richard Berthold addressed the terrorist attacks in his morning class on Western Civilization, remarking, "Anyone who can bomb the Pentagon has my vote [thefire.org]US Universities have been especially anti-American since the '60s.Of course, they don't mind that the government helps to pay their salaries. [ Reply to ThisRe:Universities are the best place to look! by mc6809e (Score:1) Saturday October 22, @09:30PM3 replies beneath your current threshold. CALEA (Score:2) by miu (626917) on Saturday October 22, @06:36PM (#13854309) (http://www.magnetbox.com/riaa/ | Last Journal: Saturday July 10, @04:34AM) The feds have had CALEA ready to spring on ISPs for a long time, this would pretty much kill smaller ISPs and probably result in rate hikes for the big guys. Title 3 warrants right now require a judge and very specific procedures (3 teams to handle raw, intermediate, final - kinda like a clean room reverse engineering job), CALEA requires none of this - requires no intervention or knowledge by the operators of the system to activate - the cops can go fishing and obtain a warrant later.I personally don't believe that it is technologically and economically possible to fully comply with CALEA, but who knows. [ Reply to This Would the money be better spent on security? (Score:1) by whyne (784135) on Saturday October 22, @06:44PM (#13854350) Why not focus on security problems within the goverment before legislating new ways to make their life easier, http://news.zdnet.com/2100-1040_22-5906643.html [zdnet.com] . [ Reply to This What happens? Stupid question. (Score:2) by FredThompson (183335) <fredthompson@miD ... om minus painter> on Saturday October 22, @06:46PM (#13854359) But with the technology infrastructure in place, what happens if congress decides to relax court order requirements in the future 'in their fight against criminals, terrorists and spies?'"--"What happens if (insert bogey-man phrase/villain of the moment here) happens?"What happens in the case of change is chage. Your question can be applied to anything, that makes the question a worthless waste of time.The article very clearly states the issue is time for compliance, not application of a law THIRTEEN YEARS after it was created. Oh, whoa for the schools, they sat on their butts for eleven years. Boo hoo. My heart aches for them. How much money from the government did they chose NOT to take over that time period? The procrastinated and now they're complaining about a situation they allowed happen. Boo hoo. [ Reply to This It's too late, baby, now, it's too late (Score:2) by handy_vandal (606174) on Saturday October 22, @06:48PM (#13854373) (http://www.karljones.com/ | Last Journal: Thursday November 13, @03:33PM) what happens if congress decides to relax court order requirements in the future 'in their fight against criminals, terrorists and spies?By the time Congress and the courts have anything to say about it, the guys who get things done have already done it. This is an old story which plays out again and again with emerging technologies.See, for example, COINTELPRO [wikipedia.org], although Watergate, Iran-Contra etc. demonstrate the same principle: Congress and the courts are less ... Executive branches of government, prone to playing straw-man mop-up roles. -kgj [ Reply to This I don't follow this issue enough, but... (Score:3, Interesting) by xigxag (167441) on Saturday October 22, @07:04PM (#13854447) What's to stop some would-be terrorist from simply encrypting his communications? He and his cohorts could probably use a one time pad so that even if older transmissions were tapped and the alleged terrorist captured, he'd be unable to disclose the old passwords to decode his old conversations.Further, I imagine that it's possible to multiplex your voice signal with some other innocuous sound-transmission so that it would be impossible to tell if you were on actually on the line or not. Would-be wiretappers would hear nothing but slightly distorted Liza Minelli showtunes. Or am I wrong? [ Reply to ThisRe:I don't follow this issue enough, but... by Anonymous Coward (Score:1) Saturday October 22, @09:55PMRe:I don't follow this issue enough, but... by xigxag (Score:2) Saturday October 22, @10:44PM